Chinese cultures, but I've searched for them online and can't find any real internet references to them other than the Paradox game tags. Is there another name that these cultures go by in the real world?
Thanks.
Thanks.
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Beifangren are northern people
Nanfangren are southern people
sort of like yankees and dixies in a very abstract way
China is a comprised of alot of cultures, historically, the northern people were more partial to the Qing Government, the southern people were supposed to be supporters of the pre-Qing government (in Vicky context) but also more "cosmopolitan" since overseas trade was more robust in the southern regions.
Other sub groups like Hakka are more dialect-orientated groups that didn't really belong to a single region.
Nanfangren are southern people
sort of like yankees and dixies in a very abstract way
China is a comprised of alot of cultures, historically, the northern people were more partial to the Qing Government, the southern people were supposed to be supporters of the pre-Qing government (in Vicky context) but also more "cosmopolitan" since overseas trade was more robust in the southern regions.
Other sub groups like Hakka are more dialect-orientated groups that didn't really belong to a single region.
For the sake of historicity, the fact that you cannot promote any Nanfangren POPs untill the revolution is mighty silly, though.
It's probably like the South-German/ North-German, and the South-Italian/ North- Italian, and so...
I mean, Mandarins came from all over China, and it was custom to have all leadership positions shared by one military Tartar ("Manchu") and one civilian Chinese (no matter which subgroup).
Even though the true elite of the country (being, the Emperor) was Tartar, every Chinese citizen from every concievable subgroup was able to reach any position possible, provided he was capable enough. Not giving the Chinese the power to fully control all their population, or not adding all subgroups to the 'national culture' list is, therefore, silly.
Even though the true elite of the country (being, the Emperor) was Tartar, every Chinese citizen from every concievable subgroup was able to reach any position possible, provided he was capable enough. Not giving the Chinese the power to fully control all their population, or not adding all subgroups to the 'national culture' list is, therefore, silly.
To not let the nanfangren be citizens is more than silly, cause they take up more than 39% of your POPs. And in a land with 400mil. thats an incredibly working force.
Part of it ties to the fact that under the Qing southern Chinese (nanfangren) were definitely excluded from power and influence in society, so they really were not "equal" citizens. It would only be with the fall of the Qing in 1911 that this handicap was, to a degree, removed.
there is a game balance issue as well - CHI already makes decent income as it is, with nanfangren included CHI would become the "yellow blob" with little for the player to actually have to do. Since there are few ways to simulate the massive problems of corruption faced by the Chinese state in acquiring central government revenue, not having nanfangren as state culture reflects the problems of revenue extraction in the South that Beijing faced during the 19th C.
So on both the historic level and the gameplay level there are quite valid reasons for not including Nanfangren as a state culture (though I think it should be added with the 1911 Revolution event myself).
there is a game balance issue as well - CHI already makes decent income as it is, with nanfangren included CHI would become the "yellow blob" with little for the player to actually have to do. Since there are few ways to simulate the massive problems of corruption faced by the Chinese state in acquiring central government revenue, not having nanfangren as state culture reflects the problems of revenue extraction in the South that Beijing faced during the 19th C.
So on both the historic level and the gameplay level there are quite valid reasons for not including Nanfangren as a state culture (though I think it should be added with the 1911 Revolution event myself).
hm ok oh you a point there, and i see it while playing.
66 now and my china is unbelievable, with the nanfangren in my pop i would be an unstoppable force.
66 now and my china is unbelievable, with the nanfangren in my pop i would be an unstoppable force.
mllfun said:
To not confuse USA players.
Likewise, what sounds better? Northern Anglo-saxon American? Or Yankee?
The Qing restored (albeit differently) the caste system first imposed by the Mongols, which went something like Mongol > Beifangren > green-eyes > Nanfangren.
But with the Ricky, the fact that you cannot promote non-state pops, and the fact that the VAST MAJORITY of factories and factory workers were Nanfangren, makes non-state Nanfangren not a viable thing to do. So I just add Nanfangren to my state pops. Which slows research down a lot, but hey, 150 mil state pops can't beat 300 mil.
But with the Ricky, the fact that you cannot promote non-state pops, and the fact that the VAST MAJORITY of factories and factory workers were Nanfangren, makes non-state Nanfangren not a viable thing to do. So I just add Nanfangren to my state pops. Which slows research down a lot, but hey, 150 mil state pops can't beat 300 mil.
Yes, as a few people have mentioned already, the promotion restriction should probably allow promotion to at least craftsmen in at least some cases.mib said:
78 now, 500mio people. And those guys are running rampand. Migration around the whole country, i have to upgrade RGOs and factories at the same time, and still im flodded with people.
If the other cultures would be full citizens i would go insane to get a job for them all.
If the other cultures would be full citizens i would go insane to get a job for them all.
OHgamer said:
Um.
Have an event fire January 1st 1836 which lowers tax and tariff effeciency to 0.5%?
Beifangren = Beijing
Nanfangren = Nanchang
im assuming in chinese language fangren must mean some sort of "people" make sense?
Nanfangren = Nanchang
im assuming in chinese language fangren must mean some sort of "people" make sense?
in chinese:
Bei = north
Nan = South
Fang = side
Ren = people
So beifangren = north side people, or people from the north.
Bei = north
Nan = South
Fang = side
Ren = people
So beifangren = north side people, or people from the north.