Why is changing the terrain of a location impossible for PC?

[Slime99]

I read through the TTs which discussed this and all I gathered was that it was impossible "in engine". I get that the Dutch will not be able to convert the ocean to land but surely the vegetation of the location changing should be no trouble right? Same goes for topography, mostly when dealing with wetlands, and even climate should change over time to represent different periods of cool and warm temperatures.

For CK3 and EU4 the answer is the physical terrain map but does PC even have a physical terrain map like those titles? All I found was some very sparse detailing which doesn't even cover every location. There does not seem to be an actual terrain color map anywhere in PC. So what gives? Why is changing the location terrain attributes impossible for PC? And if there is a hindrance to it, couldn't that hindrance be sacrificed in favor of dynamic terrain?

 

[Slime99]

All I could find was some mounds, trees and shrubs when zooming really close to the map. I could totally live with these not matching up to the terrain of the location. Especially since they don't cover every location and most changes would be on the vegetation anyways and having a forest where a farmland exists now is not the worst thing in the world in my opinion.

 

[Slime99]

And if the mismatch really does bother with peoples experience, add an option to hide the detailing.

 

[LordThanatos]

I suspect it may have more to do with the 3D terrain map we've not seen, than the 2D artwork or terrain map.

 

[Sulphurologist]

There's a 3D map component to the terrains they haven't showcased yet. The problem they're experiencing is that they can't switch out the graphical assets on terrain change.So mechanically it is possible to change forest to farmlands for instance, but the graphics will remain forest. So modding that functionality is fairly straightforward, if you don't care about the textures too much.

They stated that they don't want to implement the functionality in base game as long as it doesn't work fully as they intend it (including the graphical assets).

 

[Thrudgelmir2333]

Well, I don't know what the coding of the game is like, but if it's anything like EU4 was, I'd say that as soon as you click New Game and pick Ulm for the 100th time conquering the world, the game likely gets stuck with whatever map board it loaded up at start, and any changes to graphical assets, 3D modeling and other physical elements of the game board will then require a full reload of the entire game to be applied.

Basically, like Sulphorologist said while I was typing this, they just have too much stuff on the map that needs to be loaded from the get-go and the tech just isn't quite there yet to be able to uproot and replant entire chunks of the map's graphics just because I clicked "please spend 100 money mana on landscaping"

 

[Slime99]

And if this 3D terrain with it's assets does exist, perhaps PC would do better without them. They're certainly fairly inconsequential since we have never been shown them and the game looks fine as is.

 

[Slime99]

But if people want the 3D terrain map then I suppose that is a valid reason not to have dynamic terrain.

 

[Sulphurologist]

But if people want the 3D terrain map then I suppose that is a valid reason not to have dynamic terrain.

I definitely want 3D terrain, hot damn!

 

[Big_birdy]

Changing it in the game-logic is trivial. Its just that it will not change how it looks in terrain mapmode.

 

[gaplater]

I suspect it may have more to do with the 3D terrain map we've not seen, than the 2D artwork or terrain map.

Oh so the map wont really look like how it was shown ?

 

[Slime99]

Another option is to have a visual mismatch between the 3D assets and the terrain in a location. Since most dynamic terrain would deal with vegetation I don't think it would be too noticeable. Or make the 3D assets work like buildings. In the farmlands terrain thread the idea was raised several times.

 

[UziiLVD]

Oh so the map wont really look like how it was shown ?

My guess is that PC will have both 2D and 3D map modes, like what Imperator has.

 

[SilasW]

This feels like a major conflict between gameplay and graphics, I get that other games tend to side with graphics in such instances but for a Grand Strategy game my instinct is that gameplay should win out, especially when we’re talking such a significant addition as changeable terrain.

Maybe we’re to close to launch (though the game is yet to be announced) for it to be done for then, but a rework of the map graphics system that is now holding back substantive gameplay development should be going on the to-do list.

 

[Bisonmask]

The solution then should be to make territory that's currently farmland into grassland or whatever else accurately captures it and to make the farmland bonuses into something that happens under a certain level of cultivation

Or just a general farmland pass because the current distribution makes no sense

Zero farmland across the entirety of the Americas when even Spain has farmland is ludicrous

 

[Slime99]

The solution then should be to make territory that's currently farmland into grassland or whatever else accurately captures it and to make the farmland bonuses into something that happens under a certain level of cultivation

Or just a general farmland pass because the current distribution makes no sense

Zero farmland across the entirety of the Americas when even Spain has farmland is ludicrous

The biggest issue is the farmland. Since resources don't deplete forests not clearing out is not as jarring but farmlands are supposed to grow. Draining swamps would also be fun but farmlands is a thing that should probably be represented by buildings instead of a terrain type.

 

[Tritium666]

Why couldn't they just have a game option to allow for terrain changing? It's not like most people would care about some 3D trees on a newly grassland location, and the people that do care can toggle off the option.

Being able to cut down forests and drain swamps is pretty important (plus the farmland issue so many people have brought up) and it seems weird to prevent it based on a graphics mismatch.

 

[Creamu]

I dont think they said its impossible. Just not on release. Probably a major hurdle that would require a lot of work to look good. I'm expecting it to be a future major update accompanied by a dlc. If it happens

 

[Slime99]

Obviously I would prefer if both 3D graphics and dynamic terrain were possible, that would be the best of both worlds.

 

[HansFlammenwerfer]

you can sorta see the 3d map here

here's the image with maxxed out brightness to make it more visible.

I can imagine that changing this would be much harder compared to the 2d assets you were talking about.