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CK2 Dev Diary #105 - Clergy Interactions Revamp

Hello, everyone.

Today we will be talking of a nice quality of life update to the interface, AI behavior and some new additional flavor regarding the Papacy (as well as any similar religious head that has access to these interactions, such as a Reformed Pagan High Priest with Hierocratic Leadership).

20181019092639_1.jpg


The patch coming with Holy Fury will place all Papal Actions in a more easily accessible list of icons, right under the portrait of your religious head in the Religion screen.

Furthermore, the behavior for all these actions has been un-hardcoded and fully scripted, so the Pope is now much more sensible when deciding who he wants to Excommunicate, and less restrictive when considering the possibility of granting an Invasion casus belli to an ambitious ruler. More importantly, players are now able to see exactly why their religious head is denying them a request.

The AI logic itself has been considerably expanded and tailored to the various actions.

CatholicClergy1.jpg


Having a vassal Pope no longer ensures that all your demands will be automatically accepted, and having an independent Pope will not make it near-impossible to get a favor from him. The Pope will take into consideration Opinion, Piety, traits, the specific circumstances (such as divorcing an infertile wife), and the amount of controlled Cardinal seats when deciding whether to accept a ruler’s request or not. Piety costs for these interactions have also been rebalanced and tied to the ruler’s tier, making them more accessible to low ranking rulers and costlier to Kings and Emperors.

CatholicClergy2.jpg


The Request Claim interaction has been given a special new interface as well to make it more intuitive and accessible to players. Rather than having to search directly for the title that you wish to gain a claim on, you can use the new button in the religious view to get a list of potential Catholic rulers owning titles for which the Pope is willing to grant you a claim on. By clicking on any of them, you will be shown a second window showing the list of all titles owned by the target ruler and from there you can select the one that you are interested in.

20180824084127_1.jpg


Finally, if you are Excommunicated, the Issue Declaration of Repentance decision has been revamped so that it is no longer simply a cash payment.

Much like when requesting a coronation, the Pope will now pick one out of several possible demands for the player to fulfill in exchange for the lifting of his excommunication. Requests can range from a show of contrition causing Prestige loss, to changing your realm laws, to give one of your sons to the Church.


Also, bonus Cardinal clothes, pre and post 1245:

Cardinals preview.jpg
 
I'm loving the new clothes. It's nice that the interactions were improved to go well with the other improvements.
Concerning the Chernoban thing, maybe it implies that the ruler is earthly, i.e. just a person.
 
IL PAPA!
 
Generally,the the first Dalai Lama, Gendun juba,was born in 1391, he was a true believer,and the religious leader of Tibetan Buddhism ,not Bon.It would be totally a mistake to call the leader of Bon Dalai Lama in the year of 769,867,1066 or 1337. Bon is such an ancient pagan that the history of it is unknown , but using a Buddhist title to call the leader of Bon can be unwise . BTW, can't wait to meet the Holy Fury and 2.9 version.
 
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- Will the Pope remember what you did in order to have an excommunication lifted and take action if you go back on your word (e.g. breaking a vow of celibacy)?
- No; most events are irreversible, so that would be hard to pull off in the first place.
Celibacy in particular is simply a toggle if you're a society member. And if by "given to the church" you mean they are forced to take vows, then their monk/nun traits can still be circumvented (and lost) using factions (and possibly having their claims pressed, can't remember at the moment). Hopefully the other papal demands are more permanent as you say, but some sort of re-excommunication for going back on our word would be great.
 
Hello, everyone.

Today we will be talking of a nice quality of life update to the interface, AI behavior and some new additional flavor regarding the Papacy (as well as any similar religious head that has access to these interactions, such as a Reformed Pagan High Priest with Hierocratic Leadership).

View attachment 411771

The patch coming with Holy Fury will place all Papal Actions in a more easily accessible list of icons, right under the portrait of your religious head in the Religion screen.

Furthermore, the behavior for all these actions has been un-hardcoded and fully scripted, so the Pope is now much more sensible when deciding who he wants to Excommunicate, and less restrictive when considering the possibility of granting an Invasion casus belli to an ambitious ruler. More importantly, players are now able to see exactly why their religious head is denying them a request.

The AI logic itself has been considerably expanded and tailored to the various actions.

View attachment 411772

Having a vassal Pope no longer ensures that all your demands will be automatically accepted, and having an independent Pope will not make it near-impossible to get a favor from him. The Pope will take into consideration Opinion, Piety, traits, the specific circumstances (such as divorcing an infertile wife), and the amount of controlled Cardinal seats when deciding whether to accept a ruler’s request or not. Piety costs for these interactions have also been rebalanced and tied to the ruler’s tier, making them more accessible to low ranking rulers and costlier to Kings and Emperors.

View attachment 411773

The Request Claim interaction has been given a special new interface as well to make it more intuitive and accessible to players. Rather than having to search directly for the title that you wish to gain a claim on, you can use the new button in the religious view to get a list of potential Catholic rulers owning titles for which the Pope is willing to grant you a claim on. By clicking on any of them, you will be shown a second window showing the list of all titles owned by the target ruler and from there you can select the one that you are interested in.

View attachment 411774

Finally, if you are Excommunicated, the Issue Declaration of Repentance decision has been revamped so that it is no longer simply a cash payment.

Much like when requesting a coronation, the Pope will now pick one out of several possible demands for the player to fulfill in exchange for the lifting of his excommunication. Requests can range from a show of contrition causing Prestige loss, to changing your realm laws, to give one of your sons to the Church.


Also, bonus Cardinal clothes, pre and post 1245:

View attachment 411775
Nice update. One thing is bugging me though, if you have a vassalized pope, shouldn't it be possible to forcing them into doing something at the cost of some penalty or another? Tyranny or something perhaps, or a loss of piety, gold, prestige, or all 3 maybe?
 
It's probably a reference to the god Chernobog, who was a slavic deity. "Black" in this context probably doesn't mean evil or sinister
Well I'm pretty certain Chernobog is Satan's equivalent for the Demon Worshippers Society in the game for Slavs, Romuvas and Suomenuskos.

Edit: or was it Chernigov or something? I may have to make a new game just to check.

Edit 2: I can confirm Chernobog is the Demon Lord worshipped for Cold Ones members of Slavic faith. This means that any relation between him and the title of the Slavic religious head will directly imply Slavs practice Demonolatry as the mainstream orthodoxy. Screenshots to follow on a next edit.

Edit 3: here is the evidence that Chernobog is the "evil god" of the Slavs as featured on the game. It unfailingly says so at every step of the way. Even on the very description of the society. @Silfae I hope you or the appropiate department can look into this!

Captura de pantalla (30).png Captura de pantalla (31).png Captura de pantalla (32).png Captura de pantalla (33).png Captura de pantalla (34).png Captura de pantalla (35).png
 
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Dalai comes from a Mongolic word. Is it too strange to use it before the rising of Mongol Empire,and even the existing of the writing system of Mongolic?
Maybe Lopön or dharmaraja('King of Dharma') is more suitable?
 
Being married to a sibling will make it very easy to request a Divorce from the Pope, but it's not a necessarily a certainty. If you have a very bad ruler or the Pope really hates you, you might still stack up enough negative modifiers to not get the divorce.

I’m curious about this. According to Canon Law, there are specific grounds for annulment, and such close relations are definitively in that list. For gameplay reasona, I can understand allowing other reasons, but I can’t comprehend not automaically allowing divorce in these circumstances.
 
I am so excited for this EP. This is literally the best CK2 EP I have ever seen, and it's the exact opposite of the religious conversion disaster in EU4 (although the Hot Fix that came after the "Dharma" EP made it bearable).

With all these jaw-dropping features and long-needed fixes, I am afraid, however, that this is the finale of CK2. They're going out with a bang, and from there, CK3 will be under development in a few years as opposed to new EPs.

Personally, I am of the persuasion that CK2 could, and should, continue production for many more years. Maybe 2024 AD or so would be time fore CK3...
 
Does the Roman/Byzantine Emperors get a bonus to requesting things from Christian religious heads? Traditionally he was extremely influential and called the first 8 councils which reach into CK2's timeline. I doubt the Patriarch of Constantinople would refuse almost anything and if the pope were vassalized it would be similar.
 
Brittany starts as one de facto duchy, the way it used to be.

But the de jure kingdom has been split into three separate de jure duchies.
I still don't understand. So does this means that in the Brittany Kingdom there will now be a Brittany Duchy + two others, insead of the six counties and single duchy as it has been so far?
 
Does the Roman/Byzantine Emperors get a bonus to requesting things from Christian religious heads? Traditionally he was extremely influential and called the first 8 councils which reach into CK2's timeline. I doubt the Patriarch of Constantinople would refuse almost anything and if the pope were vassalized it would be similar.
That's because central authority was preserved in the Eastern Roman Empire. The reason the Pope became so powerful is because he filled a power vacuum after the collapse of the Western Roman Empire when secular authority was very weak. The source of the later conflict between various rulers (especially the Holy Roman Emperor) and the Pope was because those rulers reestablished their own power and had to go up against what the Pope carved out for himself