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CK2 Dev Diary #84 - Renovating Russia

Greetings!

Today we’re going back into the cartographer’s office to view the latest maps of the vast lands that lie just before the eternal steppes, where the Volga flows - the land of the proud Rus’. The Russian lands have always felt rather underdeveloped in CK2 compared to their size, even very important sites such as Kiev or Novgorod have been occupied by massive Counties that hardly give the area justice. As the area is one which lies in between the lords of feudal western europe, the Roman remnants in Byzantium and the relentless nomads of the steppes we thought it much too interesting to not develop further.

As Russia is quite big, we’ve broken the images up into three parts. These pictures are all from the year 769, so if something isn’t named as you expect it to be (i.e. Novgorod being named Ilmen) that’s the reason why.

Starting off with the north:
RussiaDD_North.png

As you can see, the definition has increased rather significantly. Historicity has also been improved, as the new borders are all based on sources from between the years ~600 to ~1300 (From proto-slavic tribes migrating in the area to the dissolution of the Kievan Rus' by internal strife and the Mongol hordes) with a focus on the 700-1100 timespan.

Now the south:
RussiaDD_South.png

Of primary note is that Kiev is now split up, and no longer one single humongous County. Those of you with sharp eyes might also notice that there is a new nomadic nation up by Radimichia and Severia - the Burtas clan, which is Turkic.

And as a bonus, Wallachia:
RussiaDD_Wallachia.png

As Bessarabia was so interconnected with the Kievan and Crimean lands, it felt right to also give the kingdom of Wallachia a facelift.

And now for the De Jure maps, as they have been requested in every previous map Dev Diary so far!

Duchies:
RussiaDD_769DeJureDuchies.png


Kingdoms:
RussiaDD_769DeJureKingdoms.png


You may notice that the old Rus’ kingdom is gone, replaced with the much more historical kingdoms of Novgorod and Vladimir. There are also several new smaller kingdoms, such as Galicia-Volhynia and Chernigov which both provide new opportunities and new risks, depending on if you’re playing in the Tribal era or Feudal era.

Empires:
RussiaDD_769DeJureEmpires.png

There was no doubt that the Tartarian empire was too big, that’s why when we had to add to it (the Kingdom of Perm is now part of it instead of Russia) we felt the need to break it up. In the south you can now see an empire of the Pontic Steppe - closely representing the Khazarian sphere of influence at its height.

Here’s a screenshot of how the 867 setup will look:
RussiaDD_867.png

And here’s 1066:
RussiaDD_1066.png

The major thing in this date is that after Yaroslav the Wise's death in 1054, his land in the Kievan Rus was divided between his 5 sons. Internal strife erupted quickly after between the sons and other relatives (like the prince of Polotsk), hurting the stability of the state.

That's why although the Kievan Rus' still existed as somewhat centralized around the Grand Prince of Kiev, at least for a while, unity wasn't the key word to describe the state. We've reflected that by keeping the different duchies independent but still tributaries to Kiev - until civil war starts again when brothers, sons, and cousins start pushing for their claims...

Changelog:
Code:
- Map Update to Russia
   - Major overhaul of the whole russian sphere
    - All major & minor rivers reshaped
    - e_russia is now created through 5 kingdoms (Ruthenia, Novgorod, Vladimir, Chernigov & Galicia-Volhynia)
    - 3 new kingdoms : Vladimir, Chernigov, Galicia-Volhynia
    - k_rus renamed from "Rus" to "Novgorod"
    - 4 new duchies (Cherven Cities, Karachev, Novosil, Murom)
    - 37 new provinces added to the general area
    - A few titular russian-tribes-themed duchies added for earlier startdates

Note that from now on, CK2 Dev Diaries will take place on Fridays rather than Mondays!
 
Whoa, thank you for the comment! :D

Say, on another note, I was browsing the Wiki earlier and I stumbled across another point that could be added to the Sarmatia debate...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarmatia_Asiatica_and_Sarmatia_Europea
According to this (and another vague entry on the main Sarmatia page), at least two cartographers after the 1400s used the term "Sarmatia" to refer to the area that overlaps with the proposed Pontic Steppe state. If the name was still considered valid for the region (at least in the western world) at that point in time, surely that makes it the most viable name for the region in the Middle Ages? I mean, there could still be loads of alternative names that come up depending on what your culture is (Khazar = Khazaria, Alan = Alania, Taurida/Crimea = Greek, etc), so that way Sarmatia as the default name comes off more as it being the placeholder name put there by a western medieval mapmaker based on Roman sources which will disappear once something actually forms to replace it...
During the late medieval period and during early renaissance it was quite common to re-use names from antuquity which didn't have to be regulary used during the time between that. The Polish scholar mentioned in the article you linked is typical example early-rennaissance scholar who - like others - took advantage of better accessability and rising popularity of sources from Greco-Roman Antiquity and there is high chance he preferred older, but Latin name over the one used by his contemporaries.

The fact that these Latinophile scholars were using some names for some regions don't mean those regions were called this way by their contemporaries. This kind of people exactly had no problem in calling contemporary France Gallia, all hispanic kingdoms Hispania etc.

EDIT: Ninja'd
 
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And *both* counts and dukes upgrade their title one rank up when independent.
There's a problem - de jure Kievan Rus is an empire, so it's easy to claim oneself as tsar of all Rus. Ivan IV did so after the CK2 era.
It's a Holy Fury patch, so Pdox may rework getting the empire title in Christian world (while HRE and BYZ alive, there shouldn't be any other Christian empires).
But if they don't, it would be good to make tsardom creating conditions harder. For example, not being a Christian, or being so AND having 8 kingdoms, including all 5 Russian ones.
 
Any chance the non russian east slavic cultures may be extended to 867 too?
 
What would that be a reference too?

Polish nobility belived that they are descendants of Sarmatians, and that Poland-Lithuania is basically new Sarmatia, so there could be new fun achievment, like "Legacy Proved!" or something for forming Empire of Sarmatia as Pole :p
 
As a Pole, first time i saw the name"Galicia-volhynia" was in EUIV. Every historian i met, every history teacher i had, every schoolbook i've read used the name "Red Rus"
Then you must've been really unlucky with your sources. I, on the other hand, heard that name multiple times way before playing EUIV. I think Galicia–Volhynia is a perfectly fine name for the kingdom in those de jure borders. Besides, "Red Rus" or "Red Ruthenia" are names associated with a geographical region and no country in history has ever called itself that.
 
Gorodno? It's the first time I see that spelling. I thought Russians spell it the same as Poles, which would be "Grodno". Unless it's a completely different place that I don't know of.

Gorodno is the Old Russian name of the city.
 
Polish nobility belived that they are descendants of Sarmatians, and that Poland-Lithuania is basically new Sarmatia, so there could be new fun achievment, like "Legacy Proved!" or something for forming Empire of Sarmatia as Pole :p
Well I still think that's a terrible name but it could be a cultural localisation for it if its owned by a polish character.
 
Gorodno is the Old Russian name of the city.
Hmm, you're right. I actually had no idea Russians used Polish names when doing transcriptions of the names of Belarusian cities. Old Russian/Old Ruthenian names fit the CK2 period much better than modern names.
 
No change for cultures, they're gonna be/behave like before


Arthur
Q: After the initial patch has been released, will you start working on the smaller aspects of the game for the accuracy(TM), such as the cultures, small native religions, special titles ETC. Also, was the main or one of the main reasons for no new cultures the fact it'd be too time consuming to research them or actually implement them in the game?
 
No change for cultures, they're gonna be/behave like before


Arthur

That's a shame. The split started occuring during this era after the fall of Kiev to the Mongols between Western Russian (Заходноруська мова/Заходноруській язик/Руська мова/Руській язик) which became modern Ukrainian and Belarusian, and Eastern Russian (Восточнорусский язык/Русский язык) which became the modern Russian Language. I understand that you are busy people, but it's rather a shame that Western Rus' cultures that became heavily influenced by Polish and Lithuanian cultures are still not represented ingame. It's quite logical for the split to occur within Rus', as it represents the diversion between Moscovite Rus' and Kieven Rus' that started with the fall to the Mongols and the subjugation by the Golden Horde, the Lithuanians and the Poles. A shame.
 
the Medici are past the timeline for CK2 as they're more properly part of the Renaissance.

The Renaissance started in Italy by the late 14th century, some scholars claim! Around the time the Médici rose to power.
 
I'm looking forward the Changing China DD this friday.
 
There's a problem - de jure Kievan Rus is an empire, so it's easy to claim oneself as tsar of all Rus. Ivan IV did so after the CK2 era.

I don't understand what this has to do with my comment, but it's an interesting observation. Ivan IV controlled de jure kingdoms of Vladimir, Novgorod and Chernigov, plus Perm, VB and Khazaria. Did he create a custom empire instead of e_russia?
 
No change for cultures, they're gonna be/behave like before


Arthur
I am greatly ashamed with what you did to Burtas!
First: they were always TRIBAL people not nomads as we can see it on the pictures.It's not a clan!!
Second: they are less likely to be turkic they were finno-ugric!!
Third: They settled near the right bank of Volga not where u placed them now!
I hope u can prove why you did such replacements to burtas, otherwise it's considered as a huge mistake!
I come from the lands where burtas people once lived and studied some of their history so i can say that now your map (towards to burtas territories and ) is now unhistorical!
Upd. OK speaking about territories it was better before but if you wish to make such changes you better know that Burtas were very few even then and I highly doubt that new places of settlement are legitimate but what makes me wonder is their new cultural and governmental status
 
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