Crusader Kings III: Chapter IV

[ruhrbaron]

so u really did go for china. i never expected u to touch east asia. not only for performance reasons but also because of the massive scope. ive wished for all of this minus east asia but thats more of a '"im not sure if the game can handle it' vs. i dont want this. really cool. still missing the college of cardinal/ deeper catholic game play (hello HRE) and merchent republics tho

so can we assume that doubling the size of the map, characters etc doesnt substantially affect the gamespeed? i trust u on this, devs

 

[Bisonmask]

Hegemonies are a perfect way to represent things like Indian Empires and Caliphal authority, will we see the system used outside East Asia?

With the map expanding so far south, are we getting the Swahili Coast city states? or will those maybe be added in a future trade expansion?

Will armies (Maa and knights) be able to revolt? I feel like adding China without adding that capacity would be disappointing

Please make an "All Under Heaven" achievement for conquering the map, as a Chinggisid ruler

 

[Anonim97]

What do you think the 1.15.0 ‘Crown’ update is if not a 'don't call it a Custodian patch' custodian patch?

A step in the right direction, but still not enough to fix the 5 years of negligence.

 

[DominusNovus]

Hegemony​

To properly represent the power and influence of China in this period, we're introducing a new tier of title above an empire: the Hegemony. This new title tier allows for further granular representation of the division of power within large-scale realms.

Dynastic Cycle​

The fate of the imperial dynasties follows a cyclical pattern, reflecting historical eras of stability and eras of chaos. Players will struggle to maintain the Mandate of Heaven and prove that they are the right choice to navigate the empire through treacherous waters.

Imperial Treasury​

A new centralized treasury system for the Chinese Emperor represents the flow of wealth upward and into the empire's coffers, letting you decide how to spend (or squander) resources that could make or break the stability of the realm.

More than anything, I am extremely interested to hear how these mechanics can apply to other empires within the game.

Obviously, on the western side of the map, there's no real hegemon at any point in the game's timeframe... historically. But anyone with a passing familiarity of history knows that the Roman Empire (aka: the end game goal for most rulers of this period) was considered equivalent to the Chinese Empire by pretty much anyone aware of both. In point of fact, the Chinese name for Rome was Da Qin - Great Qin. They explicitly saw Rome as a society similar to their own, even based on the scant knowledge they had of Rome. So, a restored Roman Empire really would be justified as an in-game hegemon comparable to any of the major Chinese dynasties of this era.

I don't know how much the dynastic cycles could apply to other realms within the game - going back to the Roman example, Roman dynasties famously (infamously?) were short-lived. In the Arab world, I suppose something could be said for the importance of the Caliphal dynasties - the Umayyads, the Abbasids, and the Fatamids, but it doesn't seem anywhere near as comparable.

The Imperial Treasury seems a good fit for anyone that is both an administrative state and an empire, perhaps even for other realms laters on in the game's timeframe.

 

[anderkickers]

With mention of dowry as a potential use for herd, is there a potential to make marriages more involved for all rulers in the future? Enabling dowry in terms of gold or land for all rulers, bargaining fealty for a marriage, or voting support for elective succession in feudal realms or acclamation/appointment support in elective realms. For a character-based game in the middle ages, diplomacy can sometimes feel a little flat, especially in the context of marriage. Tying this system to some others that already exist seems a cheap way to add some depth, perhaps along with increasing the value of alliances by reverting to a system of marriages granting solely non-aggression/faction immunity, more similar to ck2. Really looking forward to chapter four, and hoping and praying for a more modular government system in the future.

 

[IIXBatmanXII]

That would be very odd. Ladies of the inner court absolutely have been relevant throughout history and show up all the time. They can probably just limit it to the top consorts and upper ranking concubines though, for the sake of simplicity(though there can maybe be events referencing "lower" concubines who can be elevated if they catch your fancy).

After some further thought, the best I can currently come up with might be to use the current system to represent the upper ranking concubines and then allow the player to assign single, eligible women in the court as concubines, granting them modifiers and a relationship similar to lovers so that they can bear your child. These lesser concubines could use potentially use hooks or a scheme or such to elevate their position into one of the three and jostle with one another.

 

[WilliamTheIII]

I must admit that I am very disappointed in the addition of China. Not even a week ago y’all mentioned how little people play clan governments and it’s fair to say that many other areas are under played. I strongly believe that the game map should not be expanded until most areas have received unique and flavorful content similar to what was done with the Byzantine’s.

Furthermore, I hope that adding China isn’t going to destroy the performance of the game, paradox games have a history of adding a bunch of bloat that slows the game down significantly, not to be fixed for years.

This also may be a minority opinion and one that might not be even good for business, but china and Eastern Asia should be represented in its own game so that region can be given its due justice rather than just be inserted and subsequently forgotten about. I personally find that a more limited map for CK3 allows for greater character interactions and flavor, rather than a wider map where the majority of characters are irrelevant and most places are generically the same.

 

[sSpellweaver]

Another question: how much asian content is going to be in the base game? It would be a shame for them all to wear the same clothes and look the same since its a very diverse region of the world.

 

[Hellua]

Coronations are welcome i guess... Woooooow..... Still no republics? Really? As wide as the ocean and as deep as a puddle, my friends.

Why is this game even called crusader kings anymore? Histrorical major players in those events are kinda non-existing in this game.
Deep as puddle indeed.

 

[idrisz19]

Given that the addition of Indonesia will increase the role of the Indian Ocean in the game, will the Kilwa Sultanate and Swahili coastline be added to the game?

Will Madagascar be added to the game given that the Malagasy were originally pioneers who crossed the Indian Ocean from Indonesia / Malaysia?

 

[GeorgieBest]

I'm torn on this. I want to support CK3 development, but at the same time this chapter looks like a planned car crash.
The performance of the game is already pretty lacklustre after 150+ years, and I dread to think how bad things will be if the map is essentially doubled.
All of that is ignoring the obvious lack of quality that's gone into recent PDX expansions.

 

[eraydes]

There is no development regarding the Turks. Talking about the steppes and Asia while ignoring the Turks is not a well-intentioned act.

 

[christopher0936]

I just wanna get in here amid the inevitable flood of haters and losers to say hell yeah I'm so stoked for east Asia!

 

[Sylas]

My question: Can we expect reworking the Magyar names and dynasties? They still use christian names and the next steppe themed DLC would be a perfect opportunity to fix this issue. The hungarian community is already working on a list of pagan names, we can provide you the necessairy sources if you need.

 

[BoomKidneyShot]

Nevermind Cathay, how far into SEA are we going? Timor? Moluccas? Papua?

And how will the game - and most PCs - even deal with that big a map?

Is that really going to be that much more of a map? China will probably have the same density as western Europe does, and that doesn't seem like a catastrophic increase in provinces/characters.

 

[rasuuru]

I hope for changes to dynasty system. IMO random low nobility family shouldn't call themselves a "dynasty" without any accomplishments, especially now when we not only have Carolingian dynasty, for example, but also get Tang dynasty, Yuan dynasty, Song dynasty. One day maybe Merovingian dynasty.

 

[Lohcoh]

I saw it mentioned that the emperor can use the money in the imperial treasury, but can administrative officials use it?
That is to say, distinguishing between roles used for personal purposes and funds used for public purposes.
Officials may choose to embezzle a portion of money belonging to public accounts and use it for personal purposes. The emperor can do the same.
The common personal purpose is to build one's own estate (similar to the Byzantine mechanism)

If this part of the money can be used (and only this part of the money can be used) to invest in real estate or expand the estate, I think players should have sufficient motivation to create 'corruption'

Corruption from public accounts is truly a historic pleasure XD

This mechanism may also be similar to tribes.
In tribes, it is not money that is used to purchase buildings, but prestige.
If we distinguish between personal expenses and public expenses here, it would be a very interesting setting
(And it seems very simple and logically reasonable)
Of course, personal accounts cannot be obtained only through corruption. Officials should receive a portion of their salary from the empire to enrich their wallets

Here are some examples:
Part for personal use: marriage, construction of estates, buildings within estates, expenses of courtiers and family members, investment in personal real estate (if any), establishment of private armies
Part for public use: construction of general buildings, development of new land, establishment of national army

A simpler approach is that, just like how tribes build public buildings with prestige, bureaucrats here should use the "imperial treasury" to construct public buildings.
In this way, 'money' is just a personal account

 

[Garbageolopogos]

Question: why do devs continue to ignore badly needed mechanical changes to things that have been in the game since release? Why is warfare and religion still absolute trash? Why do the millions of threads on these topics get ignored? Why add China when there are massive regions that are bland, flavorless, and contentless, e.g. India, sub-sarahan Africa, Western Europe?

 

[Jia Xu]

Not to be demeaning, but was it a hard choice between this expansion and other more requested expansions from western audiences, knowing that it will inevitably be very divisive?

When CK3 was first announced, there were so many topics asking for China, that every single one of them was merged into my topic about China and that topic was pinned to the top of the board for half a year just to attempt to stop the board from being flooded with questions about when China would be coming. Before a server maintenance wiped most of the reactions from all forums, that pinned topic had 360+ positive reactions on it, pretty much equal to a really popular developer diary.

Five people around here hating on China as their entire personalities does not make this issue divisive. It is not divisive. There is overwhelming support for it. Don't let a few people trick you.

 

[rasuuru]

Is that really going to be that much more of a map? China will probably have the same density as western Europe does, and that doesn't seem like a catastrophic increase in provinces/characters.

Try to play with mods extending the map: https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...arly-try-the-asia-expansion-mods-now.1731238/. They are slower than vanilla, of course, but they don't have any support from the game engine. Vanilla East Asia would probably work faster.