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Feb 20, 2023
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Hello all!

It's been a few weeks since we spoke but it feels like longer, what with all of you having been busy traveling, touring, tournamenting and the rest! It is time for us, nonetheless, to leave behind that world for now and take a look ahead at what we have coming up next.


Vision

Our first Event Pack, Friends & Foes, gave us something of a chance to experiment. Since then, we’ve had the chance to take a look at exactly what direction we want to start moving in with these packs, and build on what worked.

One area that we hit upon was diversity of content and how the player experienced the game. Events are the ink that we daub on to the fabric of the narrative, but it’s how, what and why these events happen that govern their efficacy. Introducing new avenues for that content to reach the player is a great thing, provided it’s done in an unobtrusive way.

With that in mind, we’re going to outline a few of the new features that you’ll find in Wards & Wardens (the event-pack that you voted for last January) and its accompanying patch - both available on August 22nd. Some of them we’ll talk about more in the future, so don’t expect anything too exhaustive here, but let’s start off with…


Captivating features

Hostages aren’t quite what you’d think of when you hear the term. Rather than forced holding of a person to ransom, hostageship in the Middle Ages was a political and legal status that was absolutely widespread.

Put simply, hostages were generally given, not taken. They were, essentially, transactional guarantees. In this case, we’ve zeroed in on the most common reason for hostages to be exchanged: as a means to guarantee a peace treaty.

In Wards & Wardens, hostages are a new type of relation somewhere between a prisoner and a foreign court guest. They reside at your court as a guest would, but cannot leave of their own accord, nor can they become knights. They are generally - though not always - children, and have found themselves in such a predicament due to their liege exchanging them away as a guarantee of non-hostility following a war, or exchanged via interaction during peacetime. Such an arrangement not only eases the mediation process, but also gives both sides some peace of mind.

hostage_window.png


Hostages are essentially living non-aggression pacts. Harming a hostage is a significant diplomatic incident, but it’s also a way to deter your former enemies from getting any more bright ideas about exactly to whom that border county belongs. Any ruler that you have a hostage from will suffer significant debuffs and penalties should they try and attack you - and any wardens attacking home courts also suffer similar debuffs - so hostages present one of the strongest forms of deterrent possible.

The hostages themselves are kept in line via something else new and shiny:


In Perpetuity

We have two types of Hook extant in the game already: Strong and Weak. The latter are the type of hooks you’d get if you were to, for example, manipulate a person in some way. They are single-use, and can be refused at cost. Strong hooks, on the other hand, can be used multiple times and in a range of scenarios, but are also much rarer.

Perpetual Hooks are a new sort of hook, which wardens can get on hostages who they treat well, and represent something of a middle ground. They are refuseable like Weak hooks, but also permanent like a Strong hook. At the moment hostages (and those that have previously been hostages) are the only characters you’d expect to see with a Perpetual hook, but just as Memories were built with expansion in mind for Friends & Foes, so too should you not be surprised if in the future you find more and wider examples of Perpetual hook usage.


What An Odd Fellow!

One of the spots that we’ve been somewhat hamstrung by in CKIII is in mediating the existence of characters that don’t quite… fit the mould, as it were.

eccentric_trait.png


In CKII, you’d have insane and possessed characters who did all kinds of wacky things - immortal horse chancellors and such; you know how it goes. CKIII’s takes a more grounded approach to how traits are represented: Lunatic, for example, was used increasingly loosely in CKII, ending up as an umbrella for anything ranging from slightly kooky to genuine mental illness, but CKIII sticks much more rigidly to the latter.

This is where the Eccentric trait comes in, as a trait dedicated to the slightly odd. This allows us to group some of the more unusual situations you’d find under this new personality trait, giving them both more reason to happen for a certain character but, critically, also barring those characters who wouldn’t engage in such strange distractions from doing so. We’ll talk about this more in the coming weeks!


A Midwife Crisis

As you might expect given how hostageship skews very much towards the young, a fair percentage of what we’ve been working on has been filling out the experience of non-adult existence in Crusader Kings III. We’ve come some way in this regard since release, with Friends & Foes adding a swathe of new events and a revamp of childhood personality traits, as well as of course the Regency mechanic giving a whole new layer of intrigue to a child navigating the dangerous Medieval world.

In Wards & Wardens, we’ve added to this with another fresh layer of childhood content - in no small part focused on hostages and their experiences - but also the addition of a Wet Nurse court position. Wet nurses held an interesting status amongst the medieval court, and adding this court position adds another layer of intricacy to the trials and tribulations of raising a child.

wet_nurse.png



Mature Students

We have been delighted to read just how much you all have been enjoying all the new - and the old! - activities in CKIII since the release of Tours & Tournaments. With this in mind, we’ve attempted to utilize it to approach something that’s previously been static in Crusader Kings: education as an adult.

university_visit.png


Previously, once you had come of age, an education type and rank was assigned to you and that was that. You, aged 16, were as educated as you’d ever become! Now, whilst properly reflecting the rate at which humans grow as people as they age is something of an impossible task for a game, the current system felt a little too rigid for our liking. As such, the Adult Education activity now gives players a chance to tickle their brains at a center of learning, in hope that they can actually upgrade their education trait to a higher level!

But what of those of us who enter adulthood with the finest education life has to offer? What steps can those people take to better themselves in adulthood?

Worry not. We have a plan for that, too, but it will have to wait!


Goodbye For Now

Thankfully, however, you won’t have to wait all too long. Whilst we’re saying bye for now, next week @Areysak will be taking us through the Adult Education Activity in CKIII from top to bottom. Hope to see you all then!
 
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Are the other packs that were voted out "Love & Lust" and the other one still coming later?

We did say at the time you were voting for one of them! You shoulda campaigned harder if you wanted one of the other two! :p With that said, there's no guarantee you won't see them in the future either. They're good concepts and all of them would be worthy additions to the game. If and when we do more Event Packs, we might do another vote in the future, we might just choose one we like, we might do something in between, we might do none of that! You'll find out at the time.

Also hello all, I'll be around for the next hour or so in this thread. Hope you're having a good week so far!
 
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Are you planning to rebalance any other traits with this update? Right now Shy is basically a death sentence because almost every possible action gives you stress.

We'll be accompanying this DLC with a patch as per usual so there's bits and pieces of rebalancing that'll be done, though I don't think there's anything specifically targetting Shy here. I will say we do try to keep it in mind and throw traits like Shy and Paranoid a bone when making events, however, and I can think of at least a few in this pack that are explicitly Shy-friendly.
 
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Since this pack also focuses on raising a child, will there be a "favoritism" mechanics?

To put it simply - you play as Denethor, you absolutely adore Boromir, but you hate Faramir with your guts, even if he's your last heir. This kind of favoritism.

Not a mechanic as such; we try to leave how much you favour your kids in the player's hands without something like a 'designate favourite kid' button or the like. It's simply easier to let the player bully their offspring in a natural and gameplay-focused manner, y'see.

Crusader Kings III: Optimising Cyberbullying In Real Life In Video Games. (◕‿◕✿)
 
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I just havent seen such ways. I had multiple children that I wanted to fail, but events still had them talking friendly, their opinions of each others are high and etc. I know it's a roleplay thing, but it would be more dynamic if it had some mechanical influence.

It would explicitly be less dynamic if it had mechanical influence. I do see your point though: some prefer it to be open-ended so they can effect and craft their own narrative, whilst others prefer it a bit more spelled-out and mechanically heavy-hitting. Either way, in this case we aren't adding any mechanical influence for child favouritism, no.
 
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This DD seems... really detailed for such an early look (a little more than 2 months away). I trust we also will have free patch content to look forward to in the coming weeks, or will there be a pause in the DDs?

Well I'm glad you feel that way because I was trying my level best to actually tell you all less to save some stuff for other DDs! Hence why if I'm not answering your question it's not because I'm ignoring you, it's to leave those questions to be answered in later DDs. :D I'm glad you like it!
 
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So, what's the betting that played regencies will end up with the most attractive women as wet nurses for... reasons?

Hostages look really cool and not something I'd imagined would be included in this though! And university visits sound interesting, but my main question is whether they will result in regencies? I assume it will be traveling to a currently built uni and staying there for 6 months or something?

Funnily enough, we didn't actually factor in attractiveness when scripting the values for wet nurses. Not unless the designer who made it is holding out some critical info on me, anyway.

I'll leave the university talk for the adult education DD next week!
 
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It's actually reassuring hearing you say that. I may think I'm not the only one that saw Wards & Warden being one of the only 3 paid content this year for CK3 and being worried about the actual amount of content it would provide. Really reassuring that it seems you really want to keep the pace after T&T.

Well I did suggest we recline on our laurels and just spend the rest of the year drinking piña coladas on the beach but it turns out I'm actually getting paid to release stuff for this game, so I had to concede the point.
 
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Well, I wasn't exactly saying about heavy scripting of that kind of thing. In my vision, it needs an addition of Damaging Relations (aka the opposite of Sway), which has events that does mold that relationship in the same way as swaying.
I wasn't thinking of "Favorite Child" button that instantly does the trick because you want to.

That's very fair. I also miss Antagonise, for what it's worth. Food for thought for the future!
 
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Probably because of Midsommar. It will probably one or two diaries in June, than a huge break and than a few in August.

Actually due to Midsommar there's a 70% chance the entire team gets murdered. They made a film out of this, you really should have been paying more attention.
 
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It's not my fault everyone else voted wrong!

I have decided it is. It's all your fault. Specifically.

Interesting, the description of the Eccentric trait implies some of the sillier events may be locked behind it. Wonder if there will be a game rule to enable the trait. I don't mind the silly events but I know some people hate them.

Also, I really don't understand the Perpetual Hooks, but I suppose later DDs will give more info :)

Looking forward to this patch!

There's no game rule to enable the trait, but you're right that some of the more ridiculous events are indeed now locked behind it. Not a huge amount of them by any means, but anything that you'd think is particularly weird is a candidate for being Eccentric-locked.

It's actually quite a boon as a designer. We adhere more strictly to seriousness when it comes to our Lunatic trait in particular (compared to CKII, which used it really freely), so that left a real void to be filled. Eccentric sits in that void very nicely and gives us an outlet for kooky stuff but without it spilling over into those people who want their Count Chaddius Rex IV to be this po-faced death machine.
 
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Seconded!
I hope it's going to be tied into the trait XP system in some capacity!
And not only because I suggested just that a few days ago!

Lemme nip this one in the bud right now: it isn't. That's not for lacking the idea - trust me, I was the one who rather enthusiastically took a day to see whether I could just wholesale retrofit it in - but it's simply not in scope for this DLC.

The education system is old, old mechanics, covered in cobwebs and shambling around with a walking stick. It can be done theoretically, but CKIII has since release attempted to have a 'if it's going to be done, do it right' approach to these things, so it was definitely not worth just slapping something together and throwing it out there to work somewhat questionably.

Maybe one day. Levelled traits are my baby, so I'd love the chance to do it, but essentially what I'm saying is it's no simple task.

Hostages seem pretty great and really nice addition! Will there be peace deal options where a hostage is given?

I admit I have some reservations about the Perpetual Hooks, I like that they are refusable (imo all hooks should be) but don't love that they last forever. Treating a hostage well 10 years ago may not be important to that character now (depending of course on their traits). I think it'd be interesting in the future for hooks to take into account the personally of the hookee(?). I don't know how to solve within the current hook system design but something I've been thinking about after seemingly getting lots of hooks in my last play through, is how to make hooks a bit more dynamic and engaging as both the hook-haver and hookee

The idea with Perpetual hooks is a bit more like "you spent your entire childhood with this person as your psuedo-parent", which innately makes for a fair amount of intrigue and interpersonal drama. It may not be 'important' in the moment, but when you spend many of your formative years building bonds with people it's gonna pull you one way or another at least a little bit well into adulthood.
 
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oh actually, another thing i just remembered and wanted to ask about: in the premodern world, there were some CONCEPTS surrounding the idea of shared wetnurses. some cultures regarded sexual contact between people who shared a wetnurse as fully incestuous, for instance, even if there was no blood relation. iirc there were whole laws constructed around ideas like this. does anything in the pack touch on any part of this? some events about pseudo-sibling relationships formed by characters with the same wetnurse would be fun i think, this kinda thing is a cool jumping off point for a lot of ideas

Good knowledge! I'll let later DDs cover it in detail, but if I remember correctly we do have a few bits of content surrounding that particular aspect.
 
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I actually think there was a rare wife event that could boost your education one level when you played adult.

Perhaps? I wasn't aware of it though, so it's gotta be pretty obscure.

Is Eccentric partnered with another trait a la Zealous/Cynical. I just think it'd be funny to see characters with the "Boring" trait.

It's partnered with Fickle, along with Stubborn. In the same way Callous/Sadistic are to Compassionate, Stubborn/Eccentric are to Fickle. We didn't want to chuck in another whole personality trait (especially given that Eccentric is more of an accompaniment personality trait rather than a foundational one) due to the size of this DLC. We preferred to get Eccentric right rather than half-ass two traits. :)

With that said though, how funny would a Boring trait be? I'd find it absolutely hilarious.

Diplomacy Skill Duel: You attempt to give a rousing speech

1%: Your speech is a huge success! Everyone slaps you on the back. Lose 20 Stress.
99%: Members of the crowd fall asleep. Gain character modifier You Snooze You Lose.
 
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In the screen shots on Steam I have seen events now display which content they are from, is this just for Steam or is this for all events? If so wonderful edition.

Good eye! I believe it should be all platforms and at very least all events for this Event Pack. It's one of the things we noticed people had said a lot in F&F, that they couldn't tell which events were DLC and which weren't. Hopefully this goes some way to addressing that!
 
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With time, amount of events per month has grown. And will grow with more expansion1s1/event packs added.

Do you have plans for adjustable setting for saturation of events?
This isn’t necessarily the case. Events generally trigger from pulses. Adding events to a pulse does not make it fire more often, it only increases the pool of what could happen when the pulse fires :)
In other words, event frequency is disconnected from the amount of events added to the game.

Then there’s things like Toto where events are pushed out by activities that you choose to attend yourself - with general pulses being blocked as you travel to them. This is also why traveling comes at a bit of an opportunity cost since you’re no longer getting lifestyle xp events at all when you’re traveling (a bit countered now by points of interest).
 
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