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EU4 - Development Diary - 31st January 2017

Hello everyone, and welcome to another Europa Universalis development diary. Today we’ll take a deep look at the Manchu tribes.

As we added support for country & province modifiers for culture and culture-groups, we have tied the new unique paid mechanic for Manchu to the manchu culture itself.

If you are primary culture Manchu, in our next expansion, you will be able to raise Banners from states that have manchu cultures provinces. Each manchu province provides 1 banner for each 10 development it has, but it is all calculated on a state level, so several low development provinces together can add enough support for some banners, even if they individually can not support a banner.

Banners are required from the State Interface, and and the cost for a banner to be raised, is purely corruption. For each banner you gain 1 divided by your force limit.

Banners do not use manpower at all, but reinforce at normal monetary cost. If they reach 0 strength, the regiment is disbanded, just like mercenaries.

Banners are raised instantly at 100 men strength, so it will take a while for them to reinforce fully.

Banners are raised so that you get enough cavalry for your cavalry to infantry ratio, and the rest is raised as infantry.

If a state can no longer support enough banners, it will convert banners to regular troops at the start of a new month.

During the Absolutism Age, if you are Manchu or Qing, you can unlock the ability to increase the amount of banners you can raise by 50%, if you gain enough Splendor.

So what makes banners cool, except for having a nice purple background and not costing manpower to raise or reinforce? Well, each banner also have a +10% discipline while fighting.

The Eight Banners idea for Manchu increases the amount of banners you can raise by 25%, but if you don’t get the expansion, it will be 5% discipline still.

Another thing that’s cool with us adding banners is that we now have a nice flexible category system in the code, with normal, mercenary and banners as unit categories, and can expand upon that in the future.

If you compare the map of Manchuria compared to 1.19, you’ll notice a fair amount of tweaks as well..

eu4_14.png



Next week, we’ll be back to talk about State Edicts and the new State Interface..
 
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Can steppe nomads be able to migrate like native tribes? What's the point of even being called nomads if they aren't nomadic? If anything, they especially should be able to migrate, seasonal migration with the purpose of supporting their flocks with pastures was necessary to their lifestyle, and in many instances tribes migrated extremely long distances to found their state elsewhere (Kalmyk Khanate founded as a result of Oirat migration from Dzungarian basin to the Kuban, Nogai migration from Central Asia to Western Ukraine in order to found Budjak and Yedisan hordes, etc...)
 
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According to a source 《黑龙江古代简史》, Nurgan's etymology is the word 尼噜罕 from the Manchu language, meaning 国画.

Pamela Kyle Crossley used Nurgan to refer to the Jurchen/Manchu homeland in the book "A Translucent Mirror: History and Identity in Qing Imperial Ideology" all throughout the early Qing era. Its a valid term which was used as a geographic name and not just the name of a political unit.
Hmm, it was a long time since I read Crossley's and I'll have to take a look at Wu's work. While, I'm still relucant to acknowledge Nurgan as a popular term, considering that it appears only in Ming times, I agree that it is a good alternative to Manchuria.
 
historically, the Russian armies of this time frame were neither as disciplined as the European ones nor did they have high morale. you know, serfs being forced into service and all.
Maybe I'll surprise you, but Moscow/Russia long before 1444 had typical eastearn european feudal army with overwhelming majority of noble cavalry. Infantry not very appreciated on the wide plains.
 
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Now this. In first place this wouldn't happen if Ivan IV hadn't kill his son.
He didn't kill his son. Son was poisoned according to modern research. And it was not the cause of the time of troubles. Did you know that Ivan's other son - Fedor rules after his death for 14 years?

So, after his death **** starts, **** continues, Poland comes and, seeing all this **** and losing to Second Militia (MILITIA, CARL!!111!)
That militia consisted mostly from patriotic nobility and rich citizens that grouped around famous merchant Kuzma Minin in Nizhniy Novgorod. Prince Dmitriy Pozharskij was invited to lead the militia. It's not some peasants with clubs.

Oh, ffs. Not this again. First, it was more like feudal army. Second, yes, peasants served, like in a lot of armies during that period. Third, a lot of those peasant were used as help to artillery. Fourth, they were used for other works and, rarely, in assault of fortresses. Fifth, militia from peasants was rarely used (only in dire circumstances - cause they were feeding and supplying army). Sixth, a lot of townsman already had experience in battles (if they lived on south or near Lithuania). Seventh, at the start of 16th century (and, maybe, earlier) town population also was used as pishalniks (analog of musketeers) and they were supplied either by city, or by state. Should i continue?
Completely true.
 
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I would pay for an East Asian advisor portrait pack rather than the unit pack if there is any chance.
I prefer watching my glorious troops defeat my enemies to just seeing static advisor portraits, but I'd pay for both in this case
 
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I prefer watching my glorious troops defeat my enemies to just seeing static advisor portraits, but I'd pay for both in this case

It'll all be part of an "X DLC" content pack, judging by how Paradox has handled DLCs in the past year.
 
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I would pay for an East Asian advisor portrait pack rather than the unit pack if there is any chance.
They are integrating the Asian Advisor mod for free....
 
We didn't worry much about that, because if you manage to be big and strong enough to both get manchu and prussian culture, you have already won the game.

What about making culture converting based on adjacent provinces? Like if you are Poland and you own Portugal, you can't make all of East Prussia Portuguese or all of Portugal Silesian without having these cultures be next to them.
 
Seeing this kinda makes me think of a levy-type system like Ck2 has, It would be really interesting to see something similar to this take the form of that or act like a Mobilization mechanic like Victoria 2 had. Only problem is that both of those ideas were on opposite ends of EU4's timeline.
 
Cheers for the DD Johan, a nice little cultural-specific feature :). Am more excited about the potential mod potential m'self, although I'm guessing there's a fair chance the core game might make use of the banners feature in other ways down the track?
 
How about Berber raiding? Tying it to culture would free up the possibility of giving each Berber nation unique idea set.
True, but...
1) They're not the only ones with raiding (see The Knights).
2) Per @Republic of Mercury's comment below, HCC might "fit" better as culture, which would also free up a slot to allow more uniqueness.
However, we might still be able to free up raiding as well. How about making it tied to a special government, that Berbers and Knights start with? As an added bonus, this means it would/could go away, eventually, if the AI nations affected ever switch government type.
Hoping to see more effects from culture in the future, it seems like there'd would be a lot of possibilities there

(hint hint tie increased coring cost to culture and give Brittany/Bohemia/the Berbers an actual bonus to replace it)
Seconded.
Further suggestion on this could be: Aristocratic idea, noble loyalty act, from the cavalry bonus and maneuver to the general in that army.
You could also simply base it on combat ability and dicipline with the idea that a cavalry with higher combat ability can support more roles when it is better.
First part is seconded.

Second part is interesting, but I'm not sure that having one modifier depend on the other is the most beneficial way to go about it, when most sources of it should just have both. As an example, it has been confirmed that Poland is going to get +cav ratio in addition to its +cav combat, and in the same idea. A 1:1 proportion (for instance) would result in a 33% cav ratio increase, instead of the 10% stated. That might be too much, especially given that Poland is Eastern tech group, and therefore has the ability to get another 10% cav ratio from happy Cossacks estate.

Which is to say, good values for both modifiers are not necessarily the same.
What? This is something new, right?
Mercs have disbanded at zero strength for at least two years, probably longer. Not new.
 
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Yep.. purely from gameplay reasons.

Banners do not use manpower at all, but reinforce at normal monetary cost. If they reach 0 strength, the regiment is disbanded, just like mercenaries.

Banners are raised instantly at 100 men strength, so it will take a while for them to reinforce fully.

@Johan that makes little sense.

Instead, have banners cost 100 manpower to represent that initial investment, and have them each cost a little admin and mil points but not corruption.

Instead,
have raised banners increase corruption when not at war.

This would far better emulate the history of the Banner units as well as make the mechanic more interactive.

Additionally, for modders sake, allow banners to be renamed based on tag and culture, and let their bonus be moddable. Please at least do this.
 
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True, but...
1) They're not the only ones with raiding (see The Knights).
2) Per @Republic of Mercury's comment below, HCC might "fit" better as culture, which would also free up a slot to allow more uniqueness.
However, we might still be able to free up raiding as well. How about making it tied to a special government, that Berbers and Knights start with? As an added bonus, this means it would/could go away, eventually, if the AI nations affected ever switch government type.
1. True but irrelevant. There is nothing stopping Berbers from having it due to culture and Knights due to ideas
2. Horrible idea. The Knights were a monastic order - a completely different government from the Berbers.

Just have the two get the ability via different means. I would also suggest giving the Norse religion an ability to raid.
 
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Men, these numbers are enormous. You talking about that Russian!=zerg, but if listen to you they are!
Entire russian army in reign of Ivan IV was total around 50k of man. Most of the troops were noble cavalrymen and their servants, also cavalry (up to 70% of army).
When the Streltsy was created in 1550, their number amounted to 3k of man. To 1600 this was 10k. Later, the ratio of shooters in the army grew.
During the Time of troubles number of troops did not grow at all, for obvious reasons.

By 1680 there were ~55k streltsy. I was taking bigger numbers cause couldn't remember exact.


It should appear before. Oprichnina (which should not even be in NI set) has absolutely contrived "culture conversion cost" bonus. Morale better match to idea.

Considering, how "disciplined" was oprichnaya army - no way. They even hadn't come for one battle at all.


He didn't kill his son. Son was poisoned according to modern research. And it was not the cause of the time of troubles. Did you know that Ivan's other son - Fedor rules after his death for 14 years?

I use more known idea. IIRC this is Russian research, so it wouldn't be in english.
Always forgetting about him, sorry. But i meant, that one of the reasons was death of the last son of tsar.


That militia consisted mostly from patriotic nobility and rich citizens that grouped around famous merchant Kuzma Minin in Nizhniy Novgorod. Prince Dmitriy Pozharskij was invited to lead the militia. It's not some peasants with clubs.

It is just funny to say that militia won. Most people won't know anything about it cause they've never read about Russian history.


Pomestnoje Wojsko should get +50% forcelimit, not streltsy. This reform started in 1470th and was fully implemented to reign of Ivan IV. This allowed Russia to expand army from 20-25k in 1470th to 50k in 1550.


Oh, Pomestnoje Voisko. Yeah. This should replace streltsy, who will be moved into modifier tab :3
 
1. True but irrelevant. There is nothing stopping Berbers from having it due to culture and Knights due to ideas
2. Horrible idea. The Knights were a monastic order - a completely different government from the Berbers.

Just have the two get the ability via different means. I would also suggest giving the Norse religion an ability to raid.
1. Fair enough. Agreed that it doesn't necessarily all have to be from the same type of source.
2. Honestly forgot The Knights had a different government type. Whoops. Still think government might be a better solution for the Berbers.

Giving it to Norse sounds good.
 
So, if there are cultural bonuses besides this one, say someone mods Persian and Turkish cultures to have each their own bonus, would I only get the bonus from my main culture or would I get both if I accepted the other?

Could it be modded so that it does if not?