EU4 - Development Diary - 9th of October 2018

[dayalu]

I think that adding a large (as in, much more than I've added here for Iberia) number of new provinces in Europe would require a look at overall development balance. Particularly raising the global total amount of development. I won't say that will never happen but it isn't planned right now. And that means there's a limit on how many provinces we can add before each province becomes too weak individually.

Just a idea, but in the Beyond Typus mod they're going to do a global dev doubling.

 

[Kukumarro]

Navarra cannot into sea.

 

[Gyohdon]

There should be an achievement for occupying Ibiza as the English.
Call it "Woah, we're gonna have a party!" for a blast of 1990s nostalgia...

But the Vengaboys are Dutch

 

[Fishman786]

But the Vengaboys are Dutch

Are they? In that case, Dutch Ibiza it is!

 

[Davius]

I was trying to read the whole 17 pages of comments and I'm amazed about the big engagement and about the developer's good will and hard work because they are reading all of this mess and taking in consideration all of our suggestions. ¡GREAT JOB!

I'm really happy with all of the improvements related to the map changes, but I have to agree with most of you in some points:

- Mallorca TAG needs to be created as it really existed and it would be completely ahistorical to leave it as a part of Catalonia
- Asturias tag (even thou it's cool to have it) doesn't make sense having already León (and it's to big)
- Lleida province has to be renamed (I already saw the area it's under rework)
- Castilla la vieja would be better as Valladolid
- Dynamic province names have to be properly written on each language (valencian, euskara, and andalusian (this last should be hard).
- No need of creating Cordoba having Granada and being able to form Andalusia.

Besides this, as @neondt said at the beggining "though as always things are subject to change before release", things might change. And I'm glad that all of us are working to have the best accurate Iberia we've never seen in EU IV.

I'll just conclude saying that it would be AWESOME, historical, accurate, realistic and out of the question, to add valencian culture in all the valencian provinces. I'm not going to enter in the debate about if Valencian is the same language than Catalonian, but as a Valencian (and as historian), I can assure that our culture is not catalonian. We had different history, institutions, traditions and festivities and we are just not catalonians, like Galician are not Portuguese...

 

[BurnC]

First of all thank you for this immersion pack... it was needed.

Since i'm Portuguese i would like to say that all this discussion about Portugal needing 1 or 2 more Provinces is something that doesn't make much sense. The biggest issue with the nation in the game is the lack of power it has, and adding 1 or 2 more provinces by sacrificing the dev of other Portuguese provinces is not going to solve the issue.
The issue, and there is an issue, as mentioned before Portugal is being conquered by Morocco (and some times Granada ) way more often then Devs are saying, is only solved either by increasing the total dev of Portugal (that seems not the best way to do it as Portugal didn't have that much development historically and Paradox already said they don't wish to do it) or by adding mechanics to ensure they get a healthy enough economy to fulfill is role in he game. The ways to do it would be to adding some sort of cheaper way to colonize, either by a completely new system like they did with Russia on the Russia DLC or via an idea. (maybe a colonial idea that reduces the costs of colonizing by half and increase the tariffs from colonies without affecting their happiness)

Will be looking forward to the Ideas reworks that look to be unavoidable.

 

[pauletx]

Catalonian cultural influence would reach its peak at the beggining of 1600, when the native muslim population (around 1/3 of the time population) was expelled from Valencia (and Spain), and the repoblation of these lands by catalans, and even with them expelled, their cultural influence remained untill today. Before that, the native people was living there, merging with the christian populations that not only came from Aragon, Catalonia and Navarra, but from France and Italy pursuing a better life on the prosper Kingdom of Valencia.

A one of my fellows said earlier, Valencia was the first territory on Spain to have its own "Golden Century" starting from late XIV century, revolutionated the culture, the language, the economy and the arts of the Valencian peoples. We don't consider ourselves catalans for the sake of spanish nationalism, we consider ourselves Valencians, because we have our own history and proven facts that state that Valencian and Catalonian cultures, being similar, are different. After all, u wont consider Mexican and Spanish, or English and American, being the same culture just because they are similar.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Valencia

Sorry if something i said makes little sense, english is not my first language and sometimes what i really want to say isn't what i actually type.

 

[tommassi]

To be honest, more than the name and shape of the new provinces, what worries me most is what kind of terrain will new and old provinces be. It´s been a huge pain for many years to see Cantabria and Asturias as grasslands.

 

[McOmghall]

Spanish names for places in Galicia (those that had a name in Spanish) were used profusely during the period of the game as well as afterwards and even to this day most people use the Spanish name when speaking Spanish and the Galician name when speaking Galician.

The only ones that see an issue are nationalists who are constantly telling Galicians they're too contaminated by Spain and not pure enough.

I disagree, the only Galicians who use Castillian names for places in Galicia while speaking in Castillian nowadays are in fact, Spanish nationalists. It's widely accepted in Galicia that the only correct names are the Galician ones. I would agree that using Castillian names if a nation with Castillian as primary culture would make sense both in game and for the game's time period.

 

[Gunthah]

I disagree, the only Galicians who use Castillian names for places in Galicia while speaking in Castillian nowadays are in fact, Spanish nationalists. It's widely accepted in Galicia that the only correct names are the Galician ones.

Having lived all my life in Galicia, and having heard Orense in Spanish and Ourense in Galician all my life from basically everyone, there must be a huge amount of Spanish nationalists loose in Galicia.

Some local place names were given Spanish versions in recent decades and those are not used by many, but the ones relevant to EU4 are old and have been established for centuries.

 

[Aramenian]

will you divide the same as the Balearic Islands of the Greek Islands?

 

[McOmghall]

Having lived all my life in Galicia, and having heard Orense in Spanish and Ourense in Galician all my life from basically everyone, there must be a huge amount of Spanish nationalists loose in Galicia.

Some local place names were given Spanish versions in recent decades and those are not used by many, but the ones relevant to EU4 are old and have been established for centuries.

Sure, what if I tell you my experience is exacly the opposite one? Try saying something like "SANGHENGHO" out loud.

 

[BrokenSky]

No, but do we really want to be adding provinces to Iberia with 0 dev in any category?

Still, could be an idea for some of the provinces in the Sahara which, as I understand it, represent caravan routes rather than any actually inhabited area? (If that's the case, it might be worth giving a province modifier giving increased trade power but also increased development cost, representing these as important trade wise, but very inhospitable for actually living in?). Not sure though, this is mostly based on what other people have said.

 

[luciorp]

Mallorca will be a fun release nation to play.

 

[Kukumarro]

Still, could be an idea for some of the provinces in the Sahara which, as I understand it, represent caravan routes rather than any actually inhabited area? (If that's the case, it might be worth giving a province modifier giving increased trade power but also increased development cost, representing these as important trade wise, but very inhospitable for actually living in?). Not sure though, this is mostly based on what other people have said.

Caravan routes should be represented as connexions between trade nodes. It doesn't make sense to add provinces that are empty, that you can't develop, and which shouldn't let armies pass through.

 

[Anthorath]

Having lived all my life in Galicia, and having heard Orense in Spanish and Ourense in Galician all my life from basically everyone, there must be a huge amount of Spanish nationalists loose in Galicia.

Some local place names were given Spanish versions in recent decades and those are not used by many, but the ones relevant to EU4 are old and have been established for centuries.

Some of those Spanish names are not so recent, I was precisely thinking about the Orense/Ourense stuff, so I did a quick search in http://pares.mcu.es/ (which is a pretty good catalogue of digitalized modern era Spanish documentation) and the term Orense was used in several documents from the 1500, which suggest that the term was at least used by some Castillian speakers. It wasn´t a thorough search tough, and XVI century letter is pretty horrible to read, so I can´t confirm it blindly as I wasn´t able to check all the documents.

 

[R Rex]

I was trying to read the whole 17 pages of comments and I'm amazed about the big engagement and about the developer's good will and hard work because they are reading all of this mess and taking in consideration all of our suggestions. ¡GREAT JOB!

I'm really happy with all of the improvements related to the map changes, but I have to agree with most of you in some points:

- Mallorca TAG needs to be created as it really existed and it would be completely ahistorical to leave it as a part of Catalonia
- Asturias tag (even thou it's cool to have it) doesn't make sense having already León (and it's to big)
- Lleida province has to be renamed (I already saw the area it's under rework)
- Castilla la vieja would be better as Valladolid
- Dynamic province names have to be properly written on each language (valencian, euskara, and andalusian (this last should be hard).
- No need of creating Cordoba having Granada and being able to form Andalusia.

Besides this, as @neondt said at the beggining "though as always things are subject to change before release", things might change. And I'm glad that all of us are working to have the best accurate Iberia we've never seen in EU IV.

I'll just conclude saying that it would be AWESOME, historical, accurate, realistic and out of the question, to add valencian culture in all the valencian provinces. I'm not going to enter in the debate about if Valencian is the same language than Catalonian, but as a Valencian (and as historian), I can assure that our culture is not catalonian. We had different history, institutions, traditions and festivities and we are just not catalonians, like Galician are not Portuguese...

pfff what a joke, portuguese are south galician and so call catalan culture is just north valencian, pls don't mess with them only serious criticism

 

[R Rex]

I propose to change the catalan culture name to valencian since catalonia wasn't the cultural hub that valencia was and also valencia is just better in every way in that period

 

[Sunspawn]

Hope Navarra has its ideas reworked a bit if its losing the coastline

It wasn't. This is Pdx we're talking about.

 

[Old Tercio]

18th Century? That's a bit generous; considering Spain was such a mess it had to declare bankruptcy 4 times in the period of 1557-1596. Not to mention the Independence of the Netherlands, the loss of the Armada, complete failure of economic policies which led to spiraling inflation...

Major power; yes. Superpower? Spain was never this. In the early periods of EU4 the Superpower was the Ottomans, and in the later periods it was GB and France. The only part of the timeframe you could claim Spain as a superpower was perhaps the mid 1500's; before aformentioned Bankruptcies. But it's rather difficult to claim that Spain was the strongest nation; significantly above all others to the degree you could call it a Superpower at any point.

Then the Spanish Tercios were really OP then, Spain under bankruptcy and they continue to win battle and wars