• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Tinto Maps #11 - 19th of July 2024 - Scandinavia

Welcome everyone, today I’ll talk about the Scandinavian region. Part of it was the first maps we drew for Project Caesar back in early spring of 2020. Today we will look at all parts of the Scandinavian Peninsula (including Denmark & the Kola Peninsula). Greenland & Iceland will be looked at in a separate map talk.

Countries
SCA_countries.png

Scandinavia has only five location based countries at the start of the game. Denmark, who is in a bit of a crisis at the moment and their vassal Schleswig is in the south. On the peninsula proper, we have Sweden and Norway who are in a union at the moment as they share the same King. Scania was sold off to Sweden by the Danes five years before the start of the game.

There is no need to show off a Dynasty map, as Denmark does not exactly have a ruling King at the moment, and the rest is ruled by Magnus IV of the Bjälbo Dynasty.

Locations

sca_northlocations.png

sca_eastlocations.png

sca_westlocations.png

sca_centralocations.png


sca_southlocations.png

While Scandinavia has a lot of locations, we have to remember that this is a huge area, and together with Kola & Karelia, it is the same size as France, Spain, Portugal, Italy & Benelux together.. The size of locations are smaller in the south, particularly where the population was and still is relatively bigger.


Provinces
sca_provinces.png

We have tried to follow historical traditional province borders here, but some ended up too big like Småland, Lappland or Österbotten, which were cut into pieces, and some are just too tiny to matter.

Now I wish I had time to write up a history about each province here, but I’ll just add a few fun tidbits.

Satakunta, which is the Finnish name, is named in Finnish like the old regions of Svitjod, which were divided into “hundreds”. It was also refered to Björneborgs län, named after Björneborg (Pori in Finnish), a town founded by Johan III when Ulfsby was no longer accessible from the sea. The regiment from the area was the last Swedish Army Regiment that has ever won a battle inside Sweden, and their military march is a song I think every Finnish Citizen want to play repeatedly on TV during the Olympics..

Småland, which is divided into Tiohärad and Kalmar Län here, should really be referred to as Småländerna, as there were 12 small countries there.. Compared to the 3 other much larger countries of Svealand, Östra Götaland and Västra Götaland. And now why is Östra Götaland not containing Kinda?

Topograhy
sca_topography.png

It's mostly flatland.. I went by the rule that if the peaks are less than 500 meters it's flatland, and you need to have over 1,000 meters and rather uneven to be a mountain. Norway is interesting there.. We do have a lot of impassable areas in Norway, making this one of the most fun parts to play in.

Vegetation
sca_vegetation.png

There are some farmlands in Denmark, Scania and in Götaland, but the rest is basically a big forest.. And up north it's even worse.

Climate
sca_climate.png

Yeah, well. There is a reason I moved to Spain..


Cultures
sca_culture.png

Most of the north east is still Sami, and the Finnish tribes have not unified into the more modern Finnish culture. We decided to call the modern Meänkieli with their more ancient name of Kven. We still have Gutnish on Gotland, but the Norwegian, Danish and Swedish cultures have been becoming more monolithic already.

Religions
sca_religion.png


The Finnish are mostly Catholic, but the Sami, Tavastian, Savonia, Bjarmian and Karelians are mostly still following their old pagan beliefs. There are still some Norse people in the forests of Dalarna and Västmanland..

Raw Materials
sca_rawmaterials.png

It is mostly lumber, fish, wild game, fur and iron. We of course have the famous copper mountain as well.

Markets
sca_market.png

Scandinavia is divided by the rich markets of Lübeck and Riga. A strong Scandinavian country will probably want to set up their own unified market.


Population
sca_pop.png



Not many people live up in the north..
sca_eastpops.png


sca_west_pops.png

sca_south_pops.png

I liked nice round numbers as estimates, but the team I hired for content design are mad men, and wanted the distribution to feel more organic.. For the far north of Scandinavia we know that people were semi nomadic, and that some people lived there.. But if it was 100 there, or 250 there or 20 there it's just guesswork..


And let's end with a quote from the Greatest of Poets..

Jag vill, jag skall bli frisk, det får ej prutas,
Jag måste upp, om jag i graven låg.
Lyss, hör, ni hör kanonerna vid Jutas;
Där avgörs finska härens återtåg.



Next week Pavia is back with some German maps…
 
  • 165Like
  • 66Love
  • 6
  • 4
  • 2
Reactions:
  • 54Like
Reactions:
  • 62Like
  • 2Haha
Reactions:
  • 60Haha
  • 34Like
  • 5
  • 4Love
Reactions:
Bohuslän is the swedish name of the province. In norwegian it is Båhuslen, and Bohus is called Båhus.

We could. But provinces don't have support for dynamic names yet.
 
  • 34Like
  • 13
Reactions:
Joutsa location should be called Sysmä, since Sysmä was the dominant parish there during that time and Joutsa was later separated from Sysmä. Area map is not shown, but depending on your naming conventions the area where Sysmä (or currently Joutsa) is located should perhaps be also called Sysmä, since something like one third of the Tavastland province and parts of the Savolax province were part of Sysmä in early 15th century.
If you go with the Joutsa -> Sysmä change, you might also want to consider changing the trade good to fur, since fur trade used to be relatively big thing there. Sorry, that link is only in Finnish, but the relevant part translated below:
During the Viking and Crusader era, at the end of the first millennium and the beginning of the second, the Sysmä area was one of the most important central places in Itä-Häme. The ancient people of Sysmä had to thank for their position above all the fur trade, the proximity of the wilderness and Sysmä's favorable location along the waterways.

Lahti location should definitely be called Hollola instead, since Lahti was just a village within Hollola until Victorian era while Hollola was already mentioned in documents like Carta Marina.

Itis location should probably be Iitti in Finnish, but other than language choice the name itself is fine for that location.

Heinola location should not be Heinola, since Heinola is both located within the current Itis location and founded in the 18th century. Better name would perhaps be Mäntyharju, which was made its own parish from parts of Sysmä, Iitti, Mikkeli and Taipalsaari parishes in 1595.

Jyväskylä location should probably be Laukaa, since Jyväskylä used to be just a village within Laukaa (its even in the name, since "kylä" = "village").

Laukas location (i.e. Laukaa) should then probably be renamed to Rautalampi.

Kangasnieni location should likely be Pieksämäki instead, since Kangasniemi was part of Pieksämäki until 17th century. (This time links in Finnish, since English versions are horrible in the history part.)

Kouvola location should probably be Valkeala, since Kouvola was just a small village until railroad.

Idensalmi location should probably be Iisalmi in Finnish, but other than language choice the name itself is fine for that location.

Riistina is typo and should be Ristiina, but otherwise that name is fine as far as I know though.

Jämsä, Kuopio and Mikkeli are fine as far as I know.
 
Last edited:
  • 22Like
  • 5
  • 5
Reactions:
Shouldn't Gotland be a vassal tag at the start instead to be completely part of Sweden? I thought they had some sort of autonomy, you even gave them their own culture

Yeah, this is a tough one.
 
  • 66Like
  • 2
Reactions:
I'm concerned about the Bjarmian pops in the Kola peninsula, I don't believe they were ever the majority. At least from what I could find while reading for my posts in the Russian Tinto Maps. It is hard to tell as they are a very poorly attested people, but around Soma was majority Sami and so was much of the Kola peninsula. With the Bjarmians living roughly in the same areas as the Pomors. For more information look at Kawaii Samurai's post in the Russian Tinto Map post #384. It's really well researched and I found it extremely helpful.

Apart from that I can tell that a lot of love went into this region, it's really well represented and I'm sure we all know why. Thanks to all the team for giving us these amazing maps.
 
  • 13Like
  • 8
  • 2
Reactions:
I know you can't talk about cultural groups yet, but could you just tell me if Sami and other Finns (Finnish, Tavastians, etc...) are in the same one?

Also, when you say "some german maps" you mean the whole Germany? Including Switzerland, Austria and Czechia?
 
Last edited:
  • 6
  • 3Like
  • 1
Reactions:
1721379412509.png

"Sikkalatva" is misspelled, it should be "Siikalatva".
 
  • 15Like
  • 1
  • 1
Reactions:
I really like all this unpassable terrain in Norway. Historically the swedes had to go through Jemtland/Herjedalen to get to Trondheim/Trondhjem, and now they will have to in the game as well. Jemtland was very hostile to the swedes, and couldnt support too huge an army, if they had to live of the land.

If the swedes wanted to attack Bergen they would also most practically have to do it from the sea.
 
Last edited:
  • 13Like
  • 2
  • 1Love
Reactions:
Also, on the topic of "Län".
As these regions are part of Norway:
Båhuslen instead of Bohus Län
Bergenhuslen
instead of Bergenhus Län
Akershuslen
instead of Akershus Län

Although, the word Län/Len here seems very superfluous, as the Province was never called Bergenhuslen, it was just Bergenhus, which was the seat of the administrative unit which administrated the surrounding provinces - called a "len".


These were the four administrative provinces (from 1500 onwards), later succeeded by a modern municipality system:
Båhus
Akershus
Bergenhus
Trondhjem

I'm suggesting to drop the "Län/Len" part of the provinces.
 
Last edited:
  • 22Like
  • 8
  • 1
Reactions:
More granular than I expected. Looks great.

Also, maybe it's been answered before, but can resources change over time? I want to turn Sorsele into a sand pit.
 
Last edited:
  • 2Like
  • 1
Reactions:
Raiding Mechanics for Scandinavian Nations
  1. Will Gotland have a pirate haven-like port or similar feature?
  2. Will Scandinavian nations be able to raid coasts similarly to the north-western African pirates?
  3. Is there a requirement such as needing to convert to Norse religion to raid, or can Catholic or Animist nations also use the raid mechanic?
Thank you for your insights!
 
  • 10Like
  • 1Haha
  • 1
Reactions:
Hey, Johan!
As Jemtland is still part of Norway at the game start, should it not be called "Jemtland" - the Norwegian way of writing it?

in theory yes. province names do not have dynamic naming just yet afaik
 
  • 28Like
  • 10
  • 1
Reactions: