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Tinto Maps #15 - 23rd of August 2024 - Horn of Africa

Hello, and welcome one more week to Tinto Maps! After a short break, we’re back to the duty of sharing more maps! Today the region we will look at is the Horn of Africa! So let’s take a look at it, without further ado:

Countries:
Countries.PNG

Here we have the countries around Nubia, Ethiopia, and Somalia. The first ones are organized around the ancient kingdoms of Makuria and Alodia, which control the Upper Nile region. In the second area, the Empire of Ethiopia stands as the main power, with some smaller countries around it. Finally, the two Islamic sultanates of Ifat and Ajuraan stand as the main powers in the Horn and Somalia. Finally, around the African Great Lakes, there is a country that can be considered a ‘settled’ one, Kitara.

Dynasties:
Dynasties.PNG

The dynasties of the Horn. There are some historical ones, while others are randomly generated. The most famous one is probably the Ethiopian House of Solomon, from where all their Negus come. The Walshma ruler over both Ifat and Ajuraan and we have some others, such as the Medri of Medri Bahri, the Umar of Mogadishu, the Banu Kanz of Makuria, or the Baranzi of Kitara.

Societies of Pops:
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A new map has popped up! Here you can see the countries that we consider as ‘Societies of Pops’, as they were presented in the last Tinto Talks. We have the famous Oromo people in the lands between Ethiopia, Ifat and Ajuraan; the Kunama, Gumuz, and Berta in the lands between Ethiopia; and Alodia, and the Zaghwa to the north of Wadai; there are a few more to the west, but I’ll share that picture in the Western Africa thread, as it’s more appropriate there. There are more Stateless Societies of this kind that we would like to add in the future, if it is possible due to our schedule.

Locations:
Locations.PNG

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Locations! You might notice that the density is quite unequal. Unfortunately, the archaeological findings for the period are scarce, specially out of the most known areas and a lack of urbanization in most of the territory has made the finding of proper non-anachronistic settlements quite a challenge. Keep this in mind when making suggestions. ;) It has been that dramatic in some areas that we had to use names of tribes and rivers, a bit contradicting our own rules, but the areas had to be represented as they were active parts in the development of the region.
One thing: a big chunk of the Arabian peninsula can be seen in today’s Tinto Maps; but, please, reserve the feedback for its future DD, when we’ll show all of the peninsula. Apart from that, you can see more detailed maps if you click on the spoiler button, as usual.


Provinces:
Provinces.png


Areas:
Areas.png


Terrain:
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Vegetation.png

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The terrain types of the region are quite interesting and diverse. It is marked by the Rift Valley, which creates different biomes, such as the Ethiopian Highlands and Plateau, or the African Great Lakes. That also marks a divide between Arid, Tropical, and Oceanic climates. The vegetation of the region also ranges from desertic and sparse, to jungle forests. And one more note: you may also note that 'Marshes' have been renamed into 'Wetlands', as we could put some work into that suggestion the last week.

Natural Harbors:
Natural Harbors.png


Cultures:
Cultures.png

Another interesting map this week… You might notice that the lands of Ethiopia have a very mixed cultural situation. While more to the west and south, we are representing ‘tribal lands’ in a more homogeneous way, with kind of fixed boundaries to represent the different groupings. This doesn’t mean that there wouldn’t be a mixing of cultures, but this was one of the first areas to receive a minority's review and the scope was limited mostly to Ethiopia.

Religion:
Religion.png

Another interesting map! Miaphysite and Sunni are the more widespread religions in the region (while not all areas have their mixed populations, such as Nubia as you might notice, they eventually will as we cover more of the map in our sprints). Animism is completely placeholder, as usual, and you might see some pockets here and there (If you have specific suggestions, please do them). You may also notice a purple minority inside Ethiopia… That is representing the Beta Israel Judaism in the provinces of Semien, of course!

Raw Materials:
Raw Materials.png

The raw materials of this week! A big chunk of the region has livestock as its main raw material, while also having some agricultural goods as Wheat or Sturdy Grains here and there. The most unique good in the region is Coffee, which is cultivated in the Ethiopian highlands. And there are also some precious resources spread here and there, such as Gold, Ivory, Gems, and Incense.

Markets:
Markets.png

The main market centers of the region are Axum and Mogadishu, with ‘Adan/Aden being the main one controlling the access to the Red Sea. There are some weird calculations ongoing on the Somalian inner lands, that are already reported, and we’ll take a look at why is that happening.

Population:
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The population of the region! There are approximately 12.3M people in the Eastern African subcontinent; although take into account that it also comprises the regions of the Southern Great Lakes and the Swahili Coast, which we haven’t shown today, so we probably have to discount around 4M people from it (Swahili Coast accounts for 1.7M, and the Great Lakes for 4M, although that region is divided between today’s and next week’s Tinto Maps), for a total of around 8M.

That’s all for today! Speaking of next week’s Tinto Maps, it will be meaty, as it will cover Central, Eastern, and Southern Africa! See you!
 
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I had hoped the society of pops would allow more peoples to be interactable, but it seems that it will make even less playables than EU4. Very sad.
IDK exactly yet how many there will be compared to EU4. But you also have to take into account that this game started a century before, so there might be some peoples who would have much more complex societies in 1444 compared to 1337.
 
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A bit of feedback on the Sudan part! I’ve been studying it culturally in the past — caveat: not that much before XIX century though.

  • In terms of culture groups, it strikes the absence of Fur people (they might be minorities and not represented in the map?). However, I’ve been unable to find out when the Fur migrated into what is now Darfur. In any case, having areas called ‘North Darfur’ and ‘South Darfur’ when there are no Fur represented may be misleading. But I can’t think of any alternative historical name.
  • Having a “Sudanese Arabs” groups is a bit problematic (contemporarily also very political). So, for the ones more to the West (current Darfur, Chad region, southern Libya, including the Sahara), they should receive their tribal confederation name, which are the Baggara (assumed to be a mix of Arab tribes from the Arab peninsula and some Arabized Sahelian people). Absolutely nomadic, cattle and camel herders covering the Saharan route up to current South Sudan. They would make sense as a 'society of pops'. They never owned land until the Sultan of Darfur gave some to some subtribes in 18th or 19th century.
  • For the Arabs you have depicted east of the Nile, they should be separated from those on the West (in current ongoing civil war in Sudan, the Army is formed by Riverine Arabs and other non-Arab groups and the opposign side, RSF, is mostly Rizeighat, a Baggara Arab tribe). So we would have the Ja’alin tribe, whose folklore say they are descendent from the Abbasids in the 12th century from Hejaz, but they tend to be Arabized Nubians. A second prominent tribe are the Shaigiya, also claiming origin from Hejaz but also Arabized Nubians.
  • In sum for Arabs, you could have the 3 groups as separate cultural groups instead of “Sudanese Arabs”: Baggara in the west of current Sudan, Ja’alin and Shaigiya in the east side. Baggara could be ‘society of pops’ like you have to the Zaghawa or Tuareg, the other two not because they were more settled on the riverlands.

Edit: another prominent cultural group at least in the last 2 centuries are the Masalit people... They live in the area you categorized as North Darfur, but I'm unable for now to trace when they migrated.
 
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IDK exactly yet how many there will be compared to EU4. But you also have to take into account that this game started a century before, so there might be some peoples who would have much more complex societies in 1444 compared to 1337.

Will new societies of pops appear over time, then? My concern is the 1337 situation being crystallized even over centuries of societal development and growing complexity in many regions.
 
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Question: Who are the Baranzi dynasty of Kitara? Wikipedia says that Kitara would have been ruled by the Chwezi dynasty in this time period. All I could find on the Baranzi is that they are a traditional clan of the Baruuli people which aren't even represented on the culture map - so why do they rule over Kitara?
There are currently two dynasties attached to Kitara, the Baranzi and the Bachwezi, and it's not entirely clear which was the ruling one in 1337.
 
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As you could see last week (and in this thread so far) number of people on this forum who can give constructive feedback to the maps of sub-Saharan Africa in the XIV century isn't that high, so it's unlikely they will be overwhelmed by it.

In fact the one issue everyone agrees should be improved received so far no constructive feedback at all that I've seen - everybody wants to see animism broken up, no one knows how.
Good point with animism. I know there are people in the pdx gsg community that have developed mods expanding the African content, like BlackEmperors Africa Plus. Maybe we could try to get those devs into these threads?
 
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Of course but at least not the 100x area of hre locations bruh
As far as they respect the 3x progression (a location can only be 3 times as big as any neighboring one), it's fine for us to have locations in the world ranging from 100 to 10,000 pixels. BTW, the smallest locations in Ethiopia currently have around 200 pixels, which makes for some very dense provinces.
 
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We're doing the final touches to the region, so very, very likely next week.

PS: That's why we are reluctant to promise review dates; sometimes it has been quite fast, but with #4, we had a lot of feedback and work to address.
Will the British Isles one be next after that one or will that be delayed due to SaintDavid being away?
 
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As far as they respect the 3x progression (a location can only be 3 times as big as any neighboring one), it's fine for us to have locations in the world ranging from 100 to 10,000 pixels. BTW, the smallest locations in Ethiopia currently have around 200 pixels, which makes for some very dense provinces.
Approximately how many Km2 are equivalent to
100 pixels? IIRC, that was the lower limit (as a general rule) for locations, right?
 
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Beta Israel not solidly Jewish enough for the name of the religion to get written in the mapmode instead of just getting minority stripes? Unexpected. Is the popular image of a Jewish majority region in Eithiopia just a myth?

That is a LOT of empty land, not even occupied by Societies of Peoples. I thought those were meant to generally represent non-state cultures to allow them to resist colonization. Since there aren't SoPs in far inland of the horn, does that mean those provinces will be 100% passive not not provide active resistance to colonies beyond diseases? What's stopping Ethiopia or Ajuran from blobbing further inland?
 
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A few questions/suggestions:

- Currently the Armenian church and the Ethiopic church are represented under the Miaphisite religion but separated by different IOs, will this stay this way? I find it quite concerning if they are being lumped together in this manner as throughout the timeframe of the game, they continue to further diverge from each other, and I can't imagine that if Ethiopia takes over Armenia (or the reverse) the pops would see it as an accepted religion.

- The northern coast of Somalia is really lacking in even minor port suitability, which is not particularly accurate given the geography and importance in maritime trade of Berbera. This could also be extended to Ras Haafun or Opone given their respective geographies and historical importance, but I wouldn't necessarily give them any sort of natural harbor if Berbera doesn't get one. It can be the deepest shade of green, but Berbera is suited to be recognized with even just a little degree of a natural harbor. Additionally, Zeila should also be some degree of natural harbor as it was essentially the most important harbor of the Adal sultanate which historically appears not too long after the start of the game.

- An amber RGO (and perhaps Ivory) should be present somewhere in or around the coast of Somaliland given their Ambergris production and trade noted by Duan Chengshi. This may already be represented by the Incense RGO, but I am not sure how incense as an RGO interacts with buildings as opposed to amber so I don't have enough information to say one should be considered over the other, but do consider it as you have more information regarding the mechanics than I do.

Regardless, the map looks good. Well done given the general lack of information in this region.
 
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Society of Pops
This is one of the most challenging types of countries in the game, as most of the mechanics are not available to them. They own no land, but instead are entirely based upon the pops associated with them. As they own no land, they do not interact with RGO’s nor can build most buildings. Almost all of them start without advances for taxation, codifying laws or constructing cities.

[...]

These types of countries can migrate their pops from one province to another over time

  • Societies of Pops (Stateless Societies)
  • Societies lacking a State properly, but that have some complex organizational features, such as (not necessarily all, but some):
  • Chiefdomly authority
  • Permanent settlements
  • Agricultural development
  • Some kind of taxation

Have the criteria changed since this week's TT?
 
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With us seeing societies of pops for the first time on the map I wanted to ask if the Romani people in Europe will be portrayed as societies of pops or are there just regular pops or are the sources about them too infrequent to implement them?
 
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Currently the Armenian church and the Ethiopic church are represented under the Miaphisite religion but separated by different IOs, will this stay this way? I find it quite concerning if they are being lumped together in this manner as throughout the timeframe of the game, they continue to further diverge from each other, and I can't imagine that if Ethiopia takes over Armenia (or the reverse) the pops would see it as an accepted religion.
I really don't understand why Armenian and Coptic churches should be different religions: yes, they have different liturgical languages and practices (but not so different), but have the same theology: it's the same faith.
 
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Will Mauritius, Seychelles, and the other Indian Ocean Islands be there as well, or will there be a "Indian Ocean Islands" maps post like with the Atlantic? (Or will they be included at all given they're unpopulated at the start?)
We will probably do an 'Indian Ocean Islands' Tinto Maps Extra later in the future.
 
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