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Tinto Maps #17 - 6th of September 2024 - Arabia

Hello everyone, and welcome to one more developer diary for map lovers! This is the second this week, after the review of Poland, Ruthenia, and the Baltic. Hurray!

Today we will be taking a look at the lands of Arabia! So let’s start, without further ado:

Countries:
Countries.png

Colored Wastelands.png
This week, we have two country maps: one without colored wastelands for clarity, and one with them under the spoiler button. You might also wonder why there isn’t a third one with the Societies of Pops for the region. Well, that’s because Project Caesar has several layers to portray the simulation of a believable world (if you remember, one of our design pillars). A couple of weeks we presented the Societies of Pops as a new type of country, but if you go back to Tinto Talks #4, the Government Overview, Johan mentioned the different types of governments, which now you know are for Settled Countries. One of them is Tribal, which we think makes for a good representation of the most complex and organized tribal societies, which have some estate-like features while keeping some other tribal features.

Therefore, the way we’ve decided that fits better to portray the simulation of the Arabian Peninsula is having a divide between those countries that are Monarchies (Mecca, Yemen, Oman, Ormus, and the Jarwanids), and those that are Tribal (the rest of them). An interesting feature of the latter is that their lands will be full of Tribesmen pops, making the Tribal estate the most important one to manage. As a final note, I’d like you to understand that this is our interpretation for the simulation of the game, although it might not be the only one (as it happened with the discussions about which European countries should be decentralized with several subjects, and which shouldn’t). The good news regarding this is that we will be open to feedback and making changes, as usual; but also, that this setup can easily be changed through the script of the game, thus making it completely moddable after the game is released; so there could potentially be mods making inner Arabia covered by Societies of Pops instead of Tribal Settled countries, if you don’t like/agree with our interpretation, or just prefer it to be different.


Dynasties:
Dynasties.png

Among the dynasties of the region, you might find some old acquaintances, such as the Rasulids of Yemen or the Nabhani of Oman, while also having a bunch of new ones. And not a week without a bug, of course: the ‘al-Al’ prefix is an error, as those dynasties are using a locative, which is mixed with a second one, from the location; we will have that fixed, then.

Locations:
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The locations of the region, with more detailed maps under the spoiler button for three different sections (Northern and Central Arabia, Southern Arabia, and Eastern Arabia).

Provinces:
Provinces.png


Areas:
Areas.png


Terrain:
Climate.png

Topography.png

Vegetation.png

You might notice that most of Arabia is an arid, desertic plateau. The only exception to this is some fertile mountain valleys in Yemen, which was known as Eudaimon Arabia/Arabia Felix for a reason.

Natural Harbors:
Harbors.png


Cultures:
Cultures.png

The cultural division of the region is quite interesting, as it’s divided into several Arabic-speaking people. And for those that might wonder, yes, Socotra has its own culture, Soqotri. We still have to add some minorities here and there, though, so we will take the opportunity to do it during the map review.

Religions:
Religions.png

The religious division of Arabia is also interesting, having Sunni, Shiite, and Ibady majorities spread across the peninsula. We have yet to address the minorities, which were not ready for the Tinto Maps, so we will show what that looks like on the map, and review as well. By the way, we might do some work in the coming weeks regarding Islam, and one of the things that I think we may tweak is the coloring, as Ibadi is too similar to Shiite; so I think that this might be a good opportunity to ask for your preferences about the coloring of the different branches of the Islamic faith.

Raw Materials:
Raw Materials.png

Dates, livestock, horses, and some wheat and sand make for a healthy economy if you’re a Tribal country, I guess? Jokes aside, the desertic lands of Northern and Central Arabia have a more simple resource distribution, while Yemen and Oman, on the other hand, have quite rich resources, such as Pearls, Alum, Copper, Dyes, Silk, and Coffee (who doesn’t like a good mocha?).

Markets:
Markets.png

There are five market centers present in this region: Mecca, Al-Hajar, Al-Hasa’, Hormoz, and ‘Adan. Coupled with the resources in the previous section, the control over ‘Adan and Hormoz will be strategically relevant, as it was historically.

Population:
Population.png

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Population 4.png
This week there aren’t (almost) issues with the population of the region, so we’re able to show it to you. The entire region has around 4.5M pops, which are unevenly distributed; Yemen has 1.6M, and Mecca 776K, making for more than half of the total, while a good chunk of it belongs to the Mamluks (that control all the area around Madina.

And that’s all for this week! For the next one, I have good news: we have finished the feedback review of Anatolia, and therefore I’ll post it on Monday! That way it will make for a week without a Tinto Talks more bearable. And on Friday, there will be maps for a new region, Iran and the Caucasus! See you!
 
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I love that you've updated the Arabic script (using dots for the emphatic letters and backwards apostrophes for 'ayn), but I wish you'd be more consistent with it. Half of the names show assimilation of the al- prefix (e.g., ar-Rayn, ad-Dawāsir), but half of them don't (e.g., al-Shammar al-Sudayr). The L should assimilate if the noun begins with a D, T, S, Z, R or N.

Also, why do you sometimes use transliteration of the Arabic for cultures (like Hijāzī) but sometimes leave it English (like Yemeni). It would probably make most sense to use the English for all culture names (so Hijazi or Hejazi both of which are fully acceptable spellings in English).
Agreed, we've got to do a lot of work regarding the standardization of the Arabic script. I've forwarded this to the CD in charge of it (although he's already doing a great job, it's just that we need some more time to have it all done properly).
 
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Alright, another Topography session!

In summary:
  • I feel the topographic classification in the Asir mountain range is too forgiving in the current design, and should see a lot more mountains, impassables and ridge crossings if possible.
  • The Hajar mountains in the East are completely neglected in the current design, and should see some expansion with impassibles or ridge crossings.

Indications of where I feel ridge crossings should be present are indicated as purple lines, and were made independently of the other suggestions.

Current Topography according to TintoSuggested TopographySuggest topography "Changelog"
View attachment 1184530View attachment 1184531View attachment 1184532

Terrain Ruggedness Index for ArabiaDEM with linear color scaleDEM with exaggeration of lower topography
View attachment 1184533View attachment 1184534View attachment 1184535
Elevation \ TRI0 - 0,40,4 - 88 - 2323 - 5050+
0 - 500WetlandsFlatlandsFlatlandsHillsMountains
500 - 1250WetlandsPlateauPlateauHillsMountains
1250 - 2500WetlandsPlateauHillsMountainsMountains/Impassable
>2500WetlandsPlateauHillsMountainsImpassable

A sneak preview is the lower Mesopotamian wetlands discussion, which is very hard to define for the 1300s.
In summary:


Peat-ML map + overlay of Floodplains, Coastal landforms and Marshes from aforementioned paperGeomorphologhical map of Lower Mesopotamia from aforementioned paper
View attachment 1184542View attachment 1184543
Great job, as usual, thank you one more week!
 
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خريطة_قبائل_الجزيرة_العربية_لمستشرق_أنجليزي_قبل_مئة_سنة_وضعها_المستشرق_هارولد_ديكسون.jpg

Regardles of how central arabian tribes are represented let me issue some small corrections:
-Anizah should control Tayma and As-Samli rather than Hutaym.
-Qahtan is supposed to be bellow Dawasir not above it, that territory would be controlled by the Otaibah. (Btw, either Otaibah or Subei should get a different colour, it looks too similar)
-The area of Abu Dhabi currently controlled by the banu yas should be controlled by the Manasir instead (I would simply rename the yas)
 
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I think the historical region of Asir should probably be represented somehow, probably by splitting off the northern part of Yemen into a new area, which also would solve the issue of that region not really being part of Yemen.
 
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hello
first
yeamn isnt united at the time you have hadramiis states assirien states najranin states also (sulymanian mikhlaf (sad hakami noise))

second
jeddah dammam abu dhabi kwait im sure they have a natrule harpor

third
darya was permently settle by haniffah trip in 1440s do you plan of any michanism for forming draya pernsiplaty (first saudi state)
forth
its hard to control the middle arabia are you going to make like eu 4 wich ether controld by the otommon or the mamluke
fifth
any michanism for simi bedouin triple system like in hedjaz hadramute tahamh and assier
 
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Possible additions as natural harbors:

This is a followup from my last post about Muscat, and how it should definitely be on the higher end of a natural harbor. Anyways, the Hejaz and the Gulf region look largely incomplete, so here are some possible additions for those regions:

Hejaz:

Jeddah:
  • “Jeddah remained a key civilian harbor, serving fishermen and pilgrims traveling by sea for the Hajj…Jeddah has been established as the main city of the historic Hijaz province and a historic port for pilgrims arriving by sea to perform their Hajj pilgrimage in Mecca” - Randall Baker (1979)
  • “There are 3 natural harbors, anchorages and marinas in Jeddah…Samaco Marina, Marina Durat Al-Arous, and Silver Sands” - Harbour Maps (2015)

Should have really good harbor suitability.

Ajnuna and Al-Wagh:
  • Both could have been Leuke Kome (old sea port of the Nabateans used in older red sea trade)
  • Both have decent suitability for a natural port because of protection from winds and relatively deep seas

Should have decent harbor suitability.

Yanbu:
  • Modern red sea port, but always had some degree of shipping and fishing industries present (even if they were not major by any means) since 400 BC (didn’t expand because Medina was a better port to develop until 1975)
  • Was a major port which helped pilgrims reach Medina and complete their Hajj
  • Noted as always having good harbor suitability, being protected by wide coral reefs on nearly all sides and having less wind present

Should have good harbor suitability

Al-Jufah:
  • Not particularly important, but served as a quite small port for pilgrims and fishermen alike, with decent geography to boot

Should have one above minimum harbor suitability because it has decent wind protection
And historical relevance

Al-Qunfuda:
  • Old port dating back to 6th century AD
  • Greatly positioned to catch pilgrims from India due to winds leading directly to Al-Qunfuda
  • Decent protection from northern winds

Should have one above minimum harbor suitability because it has decent wind protection
And historical relevance

Gulf States:

Muscat (this is just a rehash of my last post):
- "The water along the coast of Muscat runs deep, forming two natural harbors, in Muttrah and Muscat" - Diane Darke (2010)
- "The harbor is small, shaped like a horse-shoe and sheltered from every wind" - Alphonso de Albuquerque (1507)
- "Muscat, boasting one of the best natural harbors in the region, flourished as an important port for a comparatively short time, from approximately the fifteenth until the early nineteenth century" - J. E. Peterson (2014)
- "Moreover, it was a port with excellent natural shelter, where sailors could safely escape bad weather and make repairs, and had plentiful supplies of good quality fresh water – a point of enormous importance to travelers departing for long and often uncertain journeys at sea" - UNESCO

Should be the maximum natural harbor suitability.

Sur:
  • Historic relevance to the sailing and shipping industries as a port since the 6th century (particularly for east africa)
  • Decent bay to protect ships from winds

Should have one above minimum harbor suitability because it has decent wind protection
And historical relevance

Suhar:
  • Famous sailing industry
  • Good soil for development
  • Historically has been the largest port in Oman north of Muscat

Should have one above minimum harbor suitability, predominantly due to not being protected from prevailing winds very well but being deep enough and well positioned

Khawr Fakkan:
  • The city, the second largest on the east coast after Fujairah City, is set on the bay of Khor Fakkan, which means "Creek of Two Jaws". It is the site of Khor Fakkan Container Terminal, the only natural deep-sea port in the region and one of the major container ports in the UAE. - In list of top 5 harbors in the middle east (2020)
  • Historically was a very good place for the Portuguese to set up shop and manage their own trade routes

Should have decent harbor suitability

Khasab (Julfar, but Khasab should get its own location):
  • The natural harbor gave shelter (to the portuguese) from rough seas
  • Only developed in the 17th century

Should have decent harbor suitability

Al Udayd:
  • While not having much historical presence, al udayd was a very good place for pirates to settle due to its protection from larger vessels provided by a small corridor to an inland sea

I don’t really know how to rank it because of its specific geographical attributes, being great for smaller vessels and horrid for larger ones, but it should have at least 1 above minimum harbor suitability

Az-Zubarah:
  • Large port for the pearl industry
  • Great geographical positioning to avoid winds while being able to stay in deeper waters

Should have relatively decent harbor suitability

Al Uqayr:
  • Consistent port since the 6th century BC
  • Fell out of usage in the 14th century because the portuguese either sacked it or made it irrelevant due to their other ports in the region
  • Generally decent geographical suitability due to its reefs

Should have one above minimum harbor suitability

Bahrain:
  • While not the greatest geographically, I am willing to let this one slide because there is a natural harbor in Manama (it just isn’t that great imo) and the portuguese used it quite a bit as a port so that they could better utilize the pearling industry

For historical railroading (so that there is actually a reason to develop the port in Bahrain) It should have relatively decent harbor suitability

Al-Qatif:
  • Extremely old seaport
  • Quite good geographical support from Tarout Bay

Should have relatively decent harbor suitability

I didn’t go over Yemen because it actually looks like the devs looked over there. Also, this really isn't my particular area of expertise, so feel free to criticize me, I'm just trying to make sure these areas are more accurately represented than literally nothing.
 
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i think yemen and oman should be connected . the 2 kindgoms had established land road . splitting them off kill the situation in arabia felix
 
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Is there really so much wheat grown in the desert of arabia?
well arabia have an importent underground water reserve so they have enough wells to maintain a pastoral society . many bedouins are farmers , only the nomads nomad for the sheeps and goats and camels and ox. those who dont nomad are either farmers with land or traders
 
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It's sad that you go different routes again for each continent.... Why are some Africans societies of people, but some weirdo Arab tribe is a playable country? Why is there no coherent design policy
 
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I'm really no fan of the wasteland density everywhere. Flatlands desert should not become impassable wasteland as is the case in northeastern arabia, unless they are big areas. Especially since small areas were crossed in a mere few days walk with provisions and wells, nothing undoable.

Likewise, I feel like EUIV or more likely CK3 resolution of impassable mountains is much more adequate, with a actual mountain being a impassaable province and not just one single summit or peak, as it seems to be the case here.
 
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What is the logic of the Peninsula having so much sand resource? I know this seems like a joke, but the sand in Arabia is actually worthless as a construction material and for glass making.
 
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Glad to see my tribe presented in Eu5 again, Dawasir, but I gotta add few things that are misplaced, First is that the Tribe dynasty should be Al-Zayid (same as Eu4 one) not Lailai. More is the population is too low for Dawasir especially that our lands were mostly farms, mostly in Wadi Al Dawasir area. Further more is that there needs at least be one horses production province since horse breeding was a thing for us.

I would love to help more if you need more sources to research.

P.S I would love to see some special missions for Dawasir since they had minor expansions in the eastern region.
 
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