HOI4 Dev Diary - Armored Cars - The new horsey boys!

[T Knight]

This answer is silly. The problem with the recon bonus is that it doesn't appreciably improve the median tactics choice enough to justify its cost. Reducing the variance of tactics choices by doubling their frequency doesn't affect their total power. Sure, rerolling twice as often will mean you get double the chances to counter enemy tactics, but they'll only last half as long so the net effect hasn't changed. Sure, close combat will resolve twice as fast, but it will become twice as common.

Your answer is like saying you could make the odds of a 50/50 coinflip transform into 66/33 by doubling the amount of flips you do. That's not how statistics works.

Maybe tactics should be given bigger bonuses to combat results to make them more relevant

 

[T Knight]

For paratroopers and infantry, bicycle recon would be a realistic option, if it was added. I remember seeing pictures of British paras with bicycles, and the Germans used bicyclists also as infantry division recon troops.

Agreed, but bicycles don't seem right with let's say Marines.

 

[Orlunu]

I hope there will be more that goes into picking what recon unit you use, and that most types will be viable in each unit, providing different benefits; otherwise you just demonstrated that the mechanic doesn't have much depth as you already figured the optimal pattern.

Pretty sure that there will be more to it than that for single player non-power-game use and niche duties, but the meta right now does basically revolve around just a small handful of optimum templates. If you're getting away from that meta, it does seem like the differences between the units should make them relatively situational to pick between.

Pretty sure children couldn't drive armored cars around, my dude, even if you wanted them to.

One at the wheel, one at the pedals. Machineguns should be fine, their mountings can deal with the recoil.

 

[plasticpanzers]

Armored cars may be at time useful for anti-partizan use they are really recon vehicles. They (and the recon forces themselves) are
designed to explore areas for offense and defense purposes. They should give some bonus for some types of attack and defense.
Anti partizan work is a waste for armies like the UK and US and USSR. Japanese and German partizans were tremendously small in
size and effect. Unless HOI4 has exaggerated them in the game.

 

[Arilou]

Armored cars may be at time useful for anti-partizan use they are really recon vehicles. They (and the recon forces themselves) are
designed to explore areas for offense and defense purposes. They should give some bonus for some types of attack and defense.
Anti partizan work is a waste for armies like the UK and US and USSR. Japanese and German partizans were tremendously small in
size and effect. Unless HOI4 has exaggerated them in the game.

While german/japanese partisans were never really an issue, the soviets continued to fight various guerilla, movements/partisans/"bandits" well into the mid-50s in places like the Ukraine and the baltics.

 

[Sighfer]

Armored cars may be at time useful for anti-partizan use they are really recon vehicles. They (and the recon forces themselves) are
designed to explore areas for offense and defense purposes. They should give some bonus for some types of attack and defense.
Anti partizan work is a waste for armies like the UK and US and USSR. Japanese and German partizans were tremendously small in
size and effect. Unless HOI4 has exaggerated them in the game.

The entire point of this DLC is to completely nerf aggressive fascist expansion. Say goodbye to Germany conquering Soviet Union and Japan conquering China by 1942.

 

[Duke_Dave]

Armored cars may be at time useful for anti-partizan use they are really recon vehicles. They (and the recon forces themselves) are
designed to explore areas for offense and defense purposes. They should give some bonus for some types of attack and defense.
Anti partizan work is a waste for armies like the UK and US and USSR. Japanese and German partizans were tremendously small in
size and effect. Unless HOI4 has exaggerated them in the game.

Colonies, plus Ukraine and the Baltics and Eastern Poland, plus as USSR you might invade further places.

 

[cnwi]

Because the reroll frequency was not high enough to achieve reliable results where combats more comonly benefit from the 5-20% advantages one doctine can have over another in terms of tactics. Achieving a more consistent advantage means more phases in a single combat where the side that got countered has org/str eroded leading to a weaker position on the next roll. You are now more likely in each combat to see the benefit of your tactics. This is important in a game where breakthroughs often revolve around fighting for a single province. With less frequent rolls you have more random results for combats.

Also, it means less time bogging down combat in close bomat tactics when they are chosen, further moving away from RNG.

While likely not the scope of this update, tactics should be reworked beyond simply changing frequency of rolls, to allow for player agency on the tactics chosen.
Here is a sound post on tactics by a forum user that I'd encourage you to read

 

[nacklus]

Thats cool and all, but can ya'll optimize the game properly in the update. Particularly late game. (Mostly because of A.I spamming divisions instead of upgrading older ones.

 

[Orlunu]

The entire point of this DLC is to completely nerf aggressive fascist expansion. Say goodbye to Germany conquering Soviet Union and Japan conquering China by 1942.

We can hope, but it'll have to wait and be seen whether the actual balancing act between frontline units and anti-partisan units works out right, and with the logistics system still in the shape that it is, it's unlikely that just the partisan overwork will make these theatres play out right - although it should be a big help.

Thats cool and all, but can ya'll optimize the game properly in the update. Particularly late game. (Mostly because of A.I spamming divisions instead of upgrading older ones.

Hopefully it'll get its own attention, but even just the moving of garrison divisions off map should go some way to helping with that.

 

[taxator]

Very nice

 

[sprites]

light armor recon.
armored horsey boys.this looks promising

 

[antonkaiser16]

is your team planing a mission tree for portugal?

 

[Mr.Grizzly]

is your team planing a mission tree for portugal?

We don't know yet, I'm guessing Italy and/or Portugal if any other countries are included in the DLC. I would hope Italy has prioritization over Portugal, leaving them until after the Soviet rework would be a very odd choice and mean we'd be stuck with the inaccurate portrayal of Italy during the war. Portugal would be interesting to tie in with the rework of the other Latin countries, but they didn't do much during the war but it's still possible due to their geographic distance and working with the Allies and contribution during the Spanish Civil War.

 

[Michael Gladius]

I agree with the idea of a dismounted infantry recon company as a form of Long Range Reconnaissance Patrol (LRRP) like the SAS or Rangers.

Will cavalry battalions become mounted infantry battalions and get a buff, since their true recon function is finally becoming a support company?

 

[Orlunu]

I agree with the idea of a dismounted infantry recon company as a form of Long Range Reconnaissance Patrol (LRRP) like the SAS or Rangers.

?

 

[Michael Gladius]

?

And don't forget the Devil's Brigade!

 

[YaBoy_Bobby]

This answer is silly. The problem with the recon bonus is that it doesn't appreciably improve the median tactics choice enough to justify its cost. Reducing the variance of tactics choices by doubling their frequency doesn't affect their total power. Sure, rerolling twice as often will mean you get double the chances to counter enemy tactics, but they'll only last half as long so the net effect hasn't changed. Sure, close combat will resolve twice as fast, but it will become twice as common.

Your answer is like saying you could make the odds of a 50/50 coinflip transform into 66/33 by doubling the amount of flips you do. That's not how statistics works.

Except thats not what im saying. I am saying you are more likely to see your statisitcal average advantage in a single combat, not that a change to frequency will somehow change the statistical average. Also, reducing the frequency of close combat phases increases the advantage of one set of doctrine tactics over the other.

 

[Mapperific]

The entire point of this DLC is to completely nerf aggressive fascist expansion. Say goodbye to Germany conquering Soviet Union and Japan conquering China by 1942.

Yeah I honestly love their purpose here, it just frustrates me how often it is completely off from IRL, and snowballing is simply too easy, so these changes are something I very much love to see.

 

[Ethereld]

The entire point of this DLC is to completely nerf aggressive fascist expansion. Say goodbye to Germany conquering Soviet Union and Japan conquering China by 1942.

It doesn't make anything to stop Japan conquering China by 1942, the thing is that if they do they won't be able to suddenly access the 100% of Chinese recourses and factories, the same about Germany. Poland, the Benelux and France may capitulate, but Germany will get a lot less of profit because of the resistance rework.