Dev Diary #113 - Community Choice Event Pack

[Anonim97]

TFW it's Wednesday and there was no Tuesday Dev Diary.

 

[Oliverjack]

I really don't want to be disappointed with this DLC, Friends and Foes made me very sad at first but later on I started to like it more and I had that thought: you know, it could be much better.
☯
Finally, I would like to wish everyone in this community a good year.

 

[Provolution]

I have read extensively on Medieval History lately, and a common theme on wardens, be it Vlad Dracul III, or the Holstein Oldenburg family to Queen Margaret of Scandinavian Union, the recurring theme is that wardens of vassals to the ruler, where dictated and dealt with during the Oath of Fealty Phase/Homage. Children were given as part of the pledge of loyalty, as money and prestige, and simply put could accumulated attribute points of each child count towards that Fealty Pledge, as an imbecile child is always of less worth than an Alpha Child, as woke culture didnt exist back then.

Also during peace settlement, CK3 could learn from Victoria 3, by adding a Diplomatic Play layer where you have a Homage to the new ruler in the beginning of the administration, and a severe penalty after two or three years if no proper homage donation is done. There should also be a diplomatic play phase on peace settlement processes with multiple winners and losers, where wards (very much like Greyjoy had to live in Winterfell after the failed war as a ward and adopted son, and similar stories) are part of the final bargain struck. Royal Council meetings with the national nobility were relatively rare in medieval times, 4-5 times over a generation of 25 years could be an indicator, if not even more rare.

For all purposes, wards where "hostages", irreplacable blood and family loss, should loyalty be broken.

Furthermore, we need more child mortalities from disease and accidents and random violence from Men and animals, as Medieval times where harsh, I feel this is kind of fake/woke and Disneylike, if we are to simulate history in the making somehow. Life was Hard, Brutish and Short, to cite Hobbes in rough terms.

Wedding of children brides (invariably girls, and very rarely young boys to a young girl, but this should have a massive prestige cost if they do these weddings at lower age intervals, as it is too expedient for the Realpolitik of bigger state entities). Philippa of England was 10 or so when she wedded King Eric of Kalmar Union and so on, it is a very long list. And when you see they carry issue/children, it is invariably much later after the wedding, 5-10 years after the fact. It may seem travel and movement in medieval times was dangerous, so they kept these blueblooded genetic egg platforms in safe storage for a few years until mobilized, for safekeeping.

Medieval children also had subspecialties as Latin or Greek School, raising a pet (cats, dogs, pigs, chicken, homing pigeons, hunting falcons, mules, horses etc). These animals could give various bonii. We also need to add encumbrance on items as well, as you need Prowess to carry armor, weapons or heavy equipment and to ride certain animals). Homing pigeons could help diplomatic range and other comm bonuses.

Finally, Europe seems to lack major community events as big trade fairs, religious events, jousting tournaments, christmas and easter celebrations etc, these were the arenas, not the generic "Meet Peers", but real color events with specific topics and specific dates of the year. Harvest had more alcohol and food, winter more risk for disease, spring more loose men and women around for bastard children making and the summer for trade fairs and major parties and social events outdoors.

 

[ToraktheNord]

Pont Valentré has 6 arches and 3 towers and according to the interwebs, that's how it's always been. Since I can't think of a reason for why they'd draw it differently(other than to possibly mislead), I'm gonna assume that it's not Pont Valentré. I'm also under the impression that the coming DLC won't be a flavor pack focusing on a specific region but something bigger or at least broader. I could be wrong...

I could very much imagine that the artist just decided to draw it differently or because they saw one of the pics with only two towers visible and decided to stick with it. Tbh I don't think there's a lot of meaning in the number of arches or towers chosen at all, I think they just used it as a reference for style.

I think what's interesting though is, that it seems to follow the aspect ratio of character view bg, event bg, and activity bgs, with the latter two being the exact same size. So we can say for certain that the picture will probably appear in either/and an event, as an activity background or a character location.

 

[ilnomederosa]

After enlisting in the South Korean army, I was waiting for the cool DLC of CK3, but honestly, the results so far are a bit disappointing...
If development proceeds at this speed and completeness, I'm worried that I won't be able to see the 'completed' of CK3 even if I get promoted to sergeant.

 

[johnty5]

After enlisting in the South Korean army, I was waiting for the cool DLC of CK3, but honestly, the results so far are a bit disappointing...
If development proceeds at this speed and completeness, I'm worried that I won't be able to see the 'completed' of CK3 even if I get promoted to sergeant.

In 2022, CK3 had one expansion pack, one flavour pack and one events pack - which is a pretty standard amount of DLC for a Paradox game in a year nowdays.

 

[Audio-Man]

Maybe "people" in the sense of the majority of the forum users here - but I'm not sure how representative that is for the overall demand. Let's take port to Consoles...me being someone solely playing on PC, it is nothing from interest to myself. And it is not unlikely that the majority of the people posting in this forum will agree. But does that automaticakky mean that not enough other console players out there will purchase CK3 to make the portation a valuable invest for Paradox? I'm not sure sure. So as odd as it may sound: I don't care for CK3 on Consoles, I don't deem a port necessary myself and I would prefer the ressources being spend elsewhere...and still I understand why it is probably done.

People will say that the Steam reviews, opinion expressed here and backlash on social media don't matter, so at this point the "fans" have turned on the fan base.

 

[Audio-Man]

In 2022, CK3 had one expansion pack, one flavour pack and one events pack - which is a pretty standard amount of DLC for a Paradox game in a year nowdays.

And how much of that was good? Also, event packs are free updates sold for money.

 

[johnty5]

And how much of that was good? Also, event packs are free updates sold for money.

I wasn't talking about quality - which is subjective anyway - I was just pointing out that the whole "CK3 development is slow" thing isn't a thing anymore.

 

[grommile]

And how much of that was good? Also, event packs are free updates sold for money.

No, they're not.

There is a free update (which will mostly be fixes), and there is an event pack alongside it.

"Modders make events as a hobby and give them away for free" does not, in fact, invalidate Paradox's decision to say "we have to pay a salary to the people who write the events that go into the official version of the game, so we are going to charge money for event packs".

 

[relytor]

I'm sorry to be mood breaker but you scroll literally any CK3 forums and you'll get people lamenting the sandbox the game is. There are so many features so far off in time and yet the game designer insists in flavorless role playing packs ? Events which bring zero variety and replayability while we miss pandemics, regency, successions flavor, regional mechanics etc
I literally made a pdx account to post this

Flavor packs are mostly created by Content Designers, while the Programmers are working on these types of mechanical additions. They don't take away from each other.

 

[Karlington]

"Modders make events as a hobby and give them away for free" does not, in fact, invalidate Paradox's decision to say "we have to pay a salary to the people who write the events that go into the official version of the game, so we are going to charge money for event packs".

This is true, but it makes it seem pretty bad when modders manage to produce more additions and/or additions of a higher quality for the game than the salaried employees of the company do.

Inb4 someone says "Ouuu, quality is subjective!" - yeah yeah, we heard you the first four hundred times, that's not my point.

 

[YouMoMCallME]

Too bad it's not Villains & Vagabonds
I think childhood in CK3 passes very quickly and I don't see the point of Wards & Wardens.

 

[rizeli_533]

After enlisting in the South Korean army, I was waiting for the cool DLC of CK3, but honestly, the results so far are a bit disappointing...
If development proceeds at this speed and completeness, I'm worried that I won't be able to see the 'completed' of CK3 even if I get promoted to sergeant.

iam good with 3 DLCs each year. So far the events for the royal court is boring and no much interaction between religions in hispania dlc. iam disappointed so far. They also brought some buyable features as free update so why iam buying the stuff at the first place. There are great mods you can test i can share my modlist if you want.

 

[krissuyx]

This is true, but it makes it seem pretty bad when modders manage to produce more additions and/or additions of a higher quality for the game than the salaried employees of the company do.

Inb4 someone says "Ouuu, quality is subjective!" - yeah yeah, we heard you the first four hundred times, that's not my point.

Saying "yeah yeah, we heard you already" doesn't negate the point being made. The quality is clearly a part of your point when you declare mods to be of higher quality.

 

[grommile]

This is true, but it makes it seem pretty bad when modders manage to produce more additions and/or additions of a higher quality for the game than the salaried employees of the company do.

"Some random modder group whose approach to content creation, schedules, and personal motivation is completely incompatible with doing the same work to the 35-hour week of a salaried employee has built a mod with three thousand events and Hypothetical Me personally thinks they're all better than anything Paradox has released" isn't a reason to attack Paradox for selling a pack of 100 events, even though it's an excellent reason for Hypothetical You, personally, to not buy the pack of 100 events.

 

[Karlington]

"Some random modder group whose approach to content creation, schedules, and personal motivation is completely incompatible with doing the same work to the 35-hour week of a salaried employee has built a mod with three thousand events and Hypothetical Me personally thinks they're all better than anything Paradox has released" isn't a reason to attack Paradox for selling a pack of 100 events, even though it's an excellent reason for Hypothetical You, personally, to not buy the pack of 100 events.

a) Criticism and disagreement is not an "attack."
b) A big gaming company with salaried employees should be able to outperform hobbyists working in their free time.

 

[TravlingCanuck]

b) A big gaming company with salaried employees should be able to outperform hobbyists working in their free time.

That's only likely to be true if there are very few hobbyists creating content. The paid employees should be able to put out content that is of above-average quality compared to all of the community-released content taken as a whole, but they're unlikely to put out content better than the best of the best. Very few D&D fans would consider the adventures released by Wizards of the Coast to be the best adventures available; very few Civfanatics would consider the expansions released by Firaxis to be the best Civilization expansions available. We may not agree on which is the best, but we're likely to agree that the best of the community-created content exceeds the quality of the available paid content. What we discount, of course, is all of the really horrible community-created content that gets released alongside the good stuff.

 

[Silens]

That's only likely to be true if there are very few hobbyists creating content. The paid employees should be able to put out content that is of above-average quality compared to all of the community-released content taken as a whole, but they're unlikely to put out content better than the best of the best. Very few D&D fans would consider the adventures released by Wizards of the Coast to be the best adventures available; very few Civfanatics would consider the expansions released by Firaxis to be the best Civilization expansions available. We may not agree on which is the best, but we're likely to agree that the best of the community-created content exceeds the quality of the available paid content. What we discount, of course, is all of the really horrible community-created content that gets released alongside the good stuff.

I'd like to add that I don't even expect the devs to create the best content.

What I do expect, however, is that they use their access to the source code and introduce mechanics that are beyond the means of modders. That they create more opportunities for modders to do stuff with the game. And, equally important, that they keep everything they release up to date and compatible with every version of the game. That is probably the main problems with mods, even good ones.

Those are the things modders can't or won't do. For me this is the main difference between modders and the devs.

 

[Karlington]

That's only likely to be true if there are very few hobbyists creating content. The paid employees should be able to put out content that is of above-average quality compared to all of the community-released content taken as a whole, but they're unlikely to put out content better than the best of the best. Very few D&D fans would consider the adventures released by Wizards of the Coast to be the best adventures available; very few Civfanatics would consider the expansions released by Firaxis to be the best Civilization expansions available. We may not agree on which is the best, but we're likely to agree that the best of the community-created content exceeds the quality of the available paid content. What we discount, of course, is all of the really horrible community-created content that gets released alongside the good stuff.

I'd like to add that I don't even expect the devs to create the best content.

What I do expect, however, is that they use their access to the source code and introduce mechanics that are beyond the means of modders. That they create more opportunities for modders to do stuff with the game. And, equally important, that they keep everything they release up to date and compatible with every version of the game. That is probably the main problems with mods, even good ones.

Those are the things modders can't or won't do. For me this is the main difference between modders and the devs.

You both make good points. With that in mind, I think they ought to focus on the kinds of DLCs @Silens mentions.

I do think that when they introduce new mechanics they ought to make new events for them, of course, as introducing a new mechanic without events and saying "Modders, generate free content for our game so this new mechanic becomes useful, please" would be rather unethical.

In other words, I don't think Paradox should release any product where the focus is just on events, if modders already do that and do it better. They haven't done this yet (I believe F&F had some sort of house feud mechanic introduced), which is good.