C.O.R.E HOI - Italy

unmerged(2826) · Mar 10, 2003

I"m not really sure but weren't the Gothic-line and Gustav-line quite important defenses? Were they only geographical defenses or did they also have real fortifications??? If so maybe an event should be included...

McNaughton · Mar 10, 2003

My Italian Work

Since I am half Italian I am very interested in improving Italian events and oob.

I have just finished a revised 1936 OOB for Italy. It gives them all of their Infantry Divisions (instead of how HoI has them as merged units) but virtually all of their Infantry Divisions are at 30 Strength (requiring 430 manpower and thousands of supplies to bring all of the Italian army up to 100 strength). Also, no single Italian unit has a brigade (representing the shortage of equipment).

I changed starting manpower from 1350 to 100 (representing that in 1936 the virtually all avalible men were already in military formations, which equal about 1200 manpower).

Each year the Italian manpower pool grows by 125.

When Germany goes to war with the Allies (with or without Italy) Italy gains 1000 manpower to their pool (representing the mobilization of the Italian army due to war in Europe, wether or not they are an immediate participant does not matter because inevitably they will). Historically Italy started to fully mobilize (i.e., not just have a lot of understrength divisions) once Germany declared war on Poland (and thereby the Allies) in 1939.

Here is the event for Italian Reserves being mobilized.

Code:

#################
# Manpower: WAR #
#################

event = { 
	id = 000000 #NO ID SELECTED
	random = no
	country = ITA

	trigger = {
		war = { country = ENG country = GER }
	}

	name = "War in Europe"
	desc = "The nation prepares for war."
	style = 0

	date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1936 } 
	offset = 1
	deathdate = { day = 30 month = december year = 1947 } 

	action_a = {
			name = "OK"
			command = { type = manpowerpool value = 400 }
	}
}

###########################
# Manpower: Fall of Libya #
###########################

event = { 
	id = 000000 #NO ID SELECTED
	random = no
	country = ITA

	trigger = {
		control = { province = 1085 = ENG } #Tripoli
		control = { province = 1097 = ENG } #Tobruk
	}

	name = "Libya Falls"
	desc = "With the fall of Libya Italy increases conscripton to prepare for the inevitable invasion of Southern Europe by the Allies."
	style = 0

	date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1936 } 
	offset = 1
	deathdate = { day = 30 month = december year = 1947 } 

	action_a = {
			name = "OK"
			command = { type = manpowerpool value = 600 } # Tripoli
	}
}

This will hopefully give Italy what they had. A large starting army that required a lot of MP and supplies to get to full strength. Even then, since none of them have brigades, they are not extremely potent attackers (just like historically being short of heavy equipment). This will result in the Italian player building only a few newer units, requiring the rest of the manpower to be used in filling out and eventually replacing losses.

Here is what I hope will happen:

1936: No military growth possible

by 1937: 125 manpower added to pool (natural growth), able to either create 4-5 new Divisions, or to fill out about 1/4 of all existing Divisions.

by 1938: 250 manpower (natural growth 125 + 125 new manpower). By this time Italy could have built 4-5 more new Divisions or fill out a total of 1/2 of all existing Divisions.

by 1939: 375 manpower (natrual growth 250 + 125 new manpower). Italy could fill out about 3/4 of all existing Divisions or build 4-5 more new Divisions.

When Germany goes to war, 400 are immediately added to the pool (enough to fill out all pre-war Divisions even if none of the pre-war natural growth was used to fill out the divisions).

When/if Libya falls, there would be an immediate mobilization of all avalible soldiers (in my event it is 600).

Historically, what Italy did was to slowly increase its armed forces from 1936-39. It built only a few extra infantry formations, but drastically incresed its armoured force (from 0 to 3 Armoured Divisions). In 1939, when Hitler started the war, Italy began its program of filling out its existing formations from peacetime strength to wartime strength. When war broke out, most avalible Italians were in service with a relatively small pool that was used for replacements. When Libya and Tunis fell in 1942-43, Italy started mobilizing as many troops as they could, which were used to form the 100 and 200 series Divisions.

After everything (including events, natural growth and existing units), by 1943 Italy should have had access to 3 300 manpower, which after calculations, appears to be a very valid number when you look at total forces mobilized (arond 3 350).

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

Italy and Germany

Historically Italy did not really join the war until it looked like Germany was just about to win it. I think that Italy should only join Germany (through an event) if France is basically defeated (i.e., Paris Falls).

Maybe have Italy only joining the war on the side of Germany if one of the two major Allied powers are defeated. Italy would never have joined Germany had both France and England were around in full strength. All of the Italian posessions in Africa would have been easily swallowed up as even in North Africa they would be surrounded by Egypt and Algeria.

I think the 'warenty/alignment' value for Italy should maintained at a certain leve if Germany is at war with BOTH France and England. When the value reaches a certain high point (close to joining Germany) an event should fire that lowers it, UNTIL France is defeated.

When one is defeated, I think that Italy should almost immediately join the war (hoping to grab some of the spoils before both Allies are defeated and make peace).

Mussolini was not a complete fool. He knew that the Italians were not in favour of a war against England or France, and knew that only a short war would really work for him. He was also very cautious in letting himself get TOO politically close to Hitler. Maybe Italy should remain fairly neutral toward joining a war until it looked like they could make some short gains. Maybe Italy should only join the Axis when Germany is at war with the Allies AND France is defeated. Italy would never have joined the Axis in peace time (when the Allies were still together as the strongest force in Europe) or when Germany was outnumbered (when France was still independent).

I also think that for every year that Italy is at war with the Allies, dissent should rise, as they really did not like Germans (due to a long history of oppression by Austria), and they saw both France and England as their historic Allies (back over a hundred years).

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

Italy Surrenders Event I

---See Below for a revised set of events---

Generalisimo · Mar 11, 2003

well, most people wanted to give that provinces (the ones that you give to the RSI) to the germans, so they keep defending them.
I was against that, and i was a defendant of your position, until someone posted a real problem, what would happen if the allies puppet RSI??? two italys???

... that's not posible...
ok, we can handle that, if the RSI is allied AND Italy is allied, the RSI is annexed... but why creating a nation that will last a couple of days??
maybe giving that territory to Germany and creating some units there, to stop quick advance of Italy into Germany will be better than wasting one of the UXX tags...

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

Originally posted by Generalisimo
well, most people wanted to give that provinces (the ones that you give to the RSI) to the germans, so they keep defending them.
I was against that, and i was a defendant of your position, until someone posted a real problem, what would happen if the allies puppet RSI??? two italys??? ... that's not posible...
ok, we can handle that, if the RSI is allied AND Italy is allied, the RSI is annexed... but why creating a nation that will last a couple of days??
maybe giving that territory to Germany and creating some units there, to stop quick advance of Italy into Germany will be better than wasting one of the UXX tags...

Well, the RSI was a fairly important political entity in the late part of the war, in my opinion. It would be fairly easy to implement a solution to the Allies puppetting the RSI and being allied with Italy, which would to create an event (like you said) to have an automatic annexation of the RSI by Italy if the RSI is either puppeted by any Allied nation, or Allied to the Allies.

Seeing that there is currently only one other U** tag currently used, I don't see much of a problem using one for the RSI. HOWEVER, since this is a democratic mod, I think that we should see exactly what the community wants to do. I could easily rescript the event so that it leaves out the RSI part (however I did create a new leader and minster file for the RSI, as well have already started on the RSI AI file).

I understand that implementing the RSI could hamper German activities in Italy as well. So I am really open to any suggestion based on the consensus of the community (however, if we have a C.O.R.E. customizer program we could have this as one of the options).

I will post what I currently have (events and leaders/ministers) in a following post.

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

Current Italy Surrenders Events II

---Obsolete (see below for current)---

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

Ministers and Leaders loyal to Fascist RSI

Leaders

Code:

NAME;ID;COUNTRY;RANK;TRAITS;SKILL;EXPERIENCE;LOYALTY;TYPE;PICTURE;x
Biscaccianti;170000;u01;2;0;2;0;5;0;unknown;x
Borghi;170001;u01;3;0;1;0;5;0;unknown;x
De Bono;170002;u01;0;513;3;0;5;0;debono_emilio2_u01;x
de Simone;170003;u01;2;128;2;0;5;0;de_simone_u01;x
Gambara;170004;u01;1;1;3;0;5;0;gambara_u01;x
Infante;170005;u01;2;0;2;0;5;0;unknown;x
Graziani;170006;u01;0;5;3;0;5;0;graziani_mar_u01;x
Ricci;170007;u01;2;131072;3;0;5;2;ricci_corrado_u01;x
Balbo;170008;u01;0;131072;3;0;5;2;balbo_u01;x

Ministers

Code:

u01;Ruling Cabinet - Start;Name;Pool;Ideology;Personality;Loyalty;Picturename;x
6000;Head of State;Benito Mussolini;NA;NS FA PA;NA;NA;mussolini_benito2_ita;x
6001;Head of Government;Benito Mussolini;NA;FA;NA;NA;mussolini_benito2_ita;x
6002;Foreign Minister;Gian Galeazzo Ciano;NA;PA;Ideological Crusader;Very High;ciano_galeazzo_ita;x
6003;Minister of Armament;Benito Mussolini;NA;FA;Military Entrepreneur;Very High;mussolini_benito2_ita;x
6004;Minister of Security;Benito Mussolini;NA;FA;Prince of Terror;Very High;mussolini_benito2_ita;x
6005;Head of Military Intelligence;Benito Mussolini;NA;FA;Naval Intelligence Specialist;Very High;mussolini_benito2_ita;x
6006;Chief of Staff;Ugo Cavallero;NA;FA;School of Manuever;High;cavallero_ugo_ita;x
6007;Chief of Army;Rodolfo Graziani;NA;FA;Decisive Battle Doctrine;Very High;graziani_rudolfo_ita;x
6008;Chief of Navy;Domenico Cavagnari;NA;FA;Decisive Battle Doctrine;Medium;cavagnari_ita;x
6009;Chief of Air Force;Italo Balbo;NA;FA;Naval Aviation Doctrine;Medium;balbo_italo_ita;x
;Replacements;;;;;;;x
6010;Foreign Minister;Giuseppe Bastianini;43;FA;Iron Fisted Brute;High;bastianini_guiseppe_ita;x
6011;Foreign Minister;Benito Mussolini;43;FA;Ideological Crusader;Very High;mussolini_benito2_ita;x
6012;Minister of Armament;Alberto Pariani;40;FA;Military Entrepreneur;High;pariani_alberto_ita;x
6013;Minister of Armament;Ubaldo Soddu;39;FA;Military Entrepreneur;Medium;soddu_ita;x
6014;Minister of Armament;Alfredo Guzzoni;40;FA;Infantry Proponent;Low;guzzoni_ita;x
6015;Minister of Armament;Antonio Scuero;41;FA;Battle Fleet Proponent;High;unknown;x
6016;Minister of Security;Guido Buffarini-Guidi;40;FA;Silent Lawyer;Low;buffarini_guidi_ita;x
6017;Minister of Security;Umberto Albini;43;FA;Silent Lawyer;High;unknown;x
6018;Chief of Army;Mario Roatta;41;FA;Armoured Spearhead Doctrine;High;roatta_ita;x
6019;Chief of Navy;Arturo Riccardi;40;FA;Indirect Approach Doctrine;Medium;unknown;x
6020;Chief of Air Force;Giuseppe Valle;40;FA;Vertical Envelopment Doctrine;Medium;valle_giuseppe_ita;x
6021;Chief of Air Force;Francesco Pricolo;39;FA;Air Superiority Doctrine;High;pricolo_francisco_ita;x
6022;Foreign Minister;Pietro Badoglio;43;PA;General Staffer;High;badoglio_pietro_ita;x

Generalisimo · Mar 11, 2003

it will be better if you use the "secedeprovince" instead of the "control" command for the changing of the ownership of the north part of Italy.

{ type = secedeprovince which = country value = IDprovince }

Generalisimo · Mar 11, 2003

well, after looking at those events, i have some "little things" that i have found....
1) why you give to Germany:
command = { type = control which = GER value = 932 } #Torino
command = { type = control which = GER value = 933 } #Genoa
command = { type = control which = GER value = 912 } #Milano
command = { type = control which = GER value = 563 } #Bolzano
command = { type = control which = GER value = 567 } #Venezia
command = { type = control which = GER value = 905 } #Bologna
command = { type = control which = GER value = 906 } #Frienze
command = { type = control which = GER value = 907 } #Ancona
command = { type = control which = GER value = 910 } #Parma
command = { type = control which = GER value = 913 } #La Spezia
but you only tranfer to RSI:
command = { type = control which = u01 value = 932 } #Torino
command = { type = control which = u01 value = 933 } #Genoa
command = { type = control which = u01 value = 912 } #Milano
command = { type = control which = u01 value = 563 } #Bolzano
command = { type = control which = u01 value = 567 } #Venezia
so, 10 provinces to Germany, but only 5 to the RSI, why not all of them?

2) the RSI must be added to the revolt.txt, i will add that, but first tell which are the minimun provinces.

3) use the "secedeprovince" command to transfer the ownership from ITA to GER.

4)after adding them to the revolt.txt AND using the "secedeprovince", you just need to use the "independence" command to create the RSI.

will you rework all that, or you want me to do it?
just tell, because i have started coding that but i haven't finished... so if you want i can finish it, just tell me if you are going to finish it or not.

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

I only gave the RSI the northern territories as if I gave them the southern ones then they would automatically deploy on the front lines. Realistically, the Germans were in 100% control of the front lines, leaving the RSI as a form of rearguard/partisan control formation. Also, giving the forward provinces to Germany might actually get them to defend them better then if they were RSI territories.

I basically followed how the Vichy event went, and they used (primarily) control to transfer provinces around. I can rework the event (also because I have added a few extra things).

I am thinking about Italy giving up all of the southern Italian provinces (barring Taranto, which would be their new capitol) to the Allies, making it easier for the Allies to continue their advance up Italy (otherwize the same problem about the Allies stalling in France due to problems of fighting on a weak foreign ally's territory will be repeated in Italy).

I will also create two versions of this event, one with the RSI, and one with Germany inheriting everything (with no RSI), as possibly the inclusion of this Fascist puppet will do more harm then good.

I should probably have the events to you by this evening (hopefully).

Generalisimo · Mar 11, 2003

Originally posted by McNaughton
I only gave the RSI the northern territories as if I gave them the southern ones then they would automatically deploy on the front lines. Realistically, the Germans were in 100% control of the front lines, leaving the RSI as a form of rearguard/partisan control formation. Also, giving the forward provinces to Germany might actually get them to defend them better then if they were RSI territories.

I basically followed how the Vichy event went, and they used (primarily) control to transfer provinces around. I can rework the event (also because I have added a few extra things).

I am thinking about Italy giving up all of the southern Italian provinces (barring Taranto, which would be their new capitol) to the Allies, making it easier for the Allies to continue their advance up Italy (otherwize the same problem about the Allies stalling in France due to problems of fighting on a weak foreign ally's territory will be repeated in Italy).

I will also create two versions of this event, one with the RSI, and one with Germany inheriting everything (with no RSI), as possibly the inclusion of this Fascist puppet will do more harm then good.

I should probably have the events to you by this evening (hopefully).

the Vichy event uses "control" because the territory remains part of France, so when you as an allied country capture them, it becomes french territory again.

You don't need to give the allies the southern provinces, just give military access to Italy.

(an event that gives military access one by one to all the members of the allies, the usual ones, ENG, CAN, AST, SAF, NZL, USA, FRA)

McNaughton · Mar 11, 2003

Updated Italy Surrenders (with RSI) III

Here it is. Unfortunatley, everytime the event triggers, the game freezes (there is nothing wrong in how the event is put together, but every time it triggers it freezes up the game). I changed the first trigger to be AI = NO (vs all of these territories occupied by a nation other then Italy) so I can test out the event in the 1936 scenario (I also removed the alliance switching events just in case), but it still just freezes. Can anyone see why? I think the problem of it freezing exists in the first event (REGIME CHANGE).

Code:

#################
# Regime Change #
#################

event = { 
	id = 462005
	random = no
	country = ITA
	
	trigger = {
		NOT = {
		control = { province = 1085 = -1 } #Tripoli not controlled by Italy
		control = { province = 1097 = -1 } #Tobruk not controlled by Italy
		control = { province = 1087 = -1 } #Sirt not controlled by Italy
		OR = {
		control = { province = 898 = -1 } #Siracusa not controlled by Italy
		control = { province = 897 = -1 } #Messina not controlled by Italy
		control = { province = 903 = -1 } #Cosenza not controlled by Italy
		control = { province = 901 = -1 } #Napoli not controlled by Italy
		}
	}
	
	name = "Failure of Fascism"
	desc = "Due to failure on all fronts King Victor Emmanuel demands the arrest of Mussolini."
	style = 0
	
	date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1936 }
	offset = 1
	deathdate = { day = 30 month = december year = 1947 }
	
	action_a = {
		name = "Arrest Mussolini" #Pro-Allied regime takes power
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3002 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3003 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3004 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3005 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3006 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3008 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3009 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3010 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3031 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3032 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3033 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3034 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3035 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3036 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3037 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3038 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3039 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3040 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepminister which = 3041 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = headofgovernment which = 3011 }
		command = { type = foreignminister which = 3012 }
		command = { type = armamentminister which = 3013 }
		command = { type = ministerofsecurity which = 3014 }
		command = { type = ministerofintelligence which = 3015 }
		command = { type = chiefofstaff which = 3016 }
		command = { type = chiefofarmy which = 3017 }
		command = { type = chiefofnavy which = 3018 }
		command = { type = chiefofair which = 3019 }
		command = { type = dissent value = -10 }
		command = { type = alignment which = democratic value = 30 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 462006 } #Italy Surrenders
	}
	action_b = {
		name = "Keep Mussolini in power"
		command = { type = dissent value = 10 }
		command = { type = manpowerpool value = -200 } #Desertions
	}
}

####################
# Italy Surrenders #
####################

event = { 
	id = 462006
	random = no
	country = ITA
	
	# Triggered by Action A of 'Regime Change' Event
	
	name = "Decisive Decision"
	desc = "The Allies are at the gates of our nation.  What shall we do?"
	style = 0
	
	action_a = {
		name = "Surrender to the Allies"
		command = { type = peace which = ENG value = 1 }
		command = { type = leave_alliance which = GER }
		command = { type = alliance which = ENG }
		command = { type = dissent value = -10 }
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 563 } #Bolzano
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 567 } #Venezia
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 905 } #Bologna
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 906 } #Frienze
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 907 } #Ancona
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 910 } #Parma
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 912 } #Milano
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 913 } #La Spezia
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 932 } #Torino
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = GER value = 933 } #Genoa
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6046 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6052 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6083 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6090 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6104 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6212 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6214 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6218 } #Loyal Fascist
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6005 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6029 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6055 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6069 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6107 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6135 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6136 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6155 } #German POW
		command = { type = sleepleader which = 6156 } #German POW
		command = { type = access which = ENG }
		command = { type = access which = FRA }
		command = { type = access which = CAN }
		command = { type = access which = USA }
		command = { type = access which = AST }
		command = { type = access which = NZL }
		command = { type = access which = SAF }
		command = { type = access which = BEL }
		command = { type = access which = HOL }
		command = { type = independence which = u01 value = 0 } #RSI created
		command = { type = trigger which = 462008 } #German 'Rescue Mussolini' Event
	}
	action_b = {
		name = "Remain as a part of the Axis"
		command = { type = dissent value = 20 }
		command = { type = manpowerpool value = -500 } #Desertions
	}
}

####################
# Rescue Mussolini #
####################

event = { 
	id = 462008
	random = no
	country = GER
	
	# Triggered by Action A of 'Italy Surrenders' Event
	
	name = "Repubblica Sociale Italiana"
	desc = "The Germans established a puppet RSI government in Northern Italy under the nominal command of a rescued Mussolini."
	style = 0
	
	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = make_puppet which = u01 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 462009 } #RSI
	}
}

#######
# RSI #
#######

event = { 
	id = 462009
	random = no
	country = u01
	
	# Triggered by Action A of 'Rescue Mussolini' Event
	
	name = "Repubblica Sociale Italiana"
	desc = "The Germans established a puppet RSI government in Northern Italy under the nominal command of a rescued Mussolini."
	style = 0
	
	action_a = {
		name = "OK"
		command = { type = add_division which = infantry when = 932 }
		command = { type = add_division which = infantry when = 932 }
		command = { type = add_division which = bergsjaeger when = 932 }
		command = { type = add_division which = motorized when = 932 }
		command = { type = access which = GER }
		command = { type = alliance which = GER }
	}
}

Generalisimo · Mar 11, 2003

well, here it is what i saw:
1) command = { type = leave_alliance which = GER }
the command leave alliance doesn't have a which clause.

2) command = { type = peace which = ENG value = 1 }
if you put this line why you put the line in 1) ??

3) you don't mention it, but i supose you done it, but, just in case... you need to add U01 to the revolt.txt, keep the same syntax that the others have.

cheers.

unmerged(13601) · Mar 12, 2003

Regarding RSI and german controlled parts of Italy. Have you considered the supply question for those German frontier provinces? This as they are cut-off from Germany by the RSI and Germany has no way of sending convoys unless it owns toulon or marseille or split. Especially in case of a AI played Germany, as I am not certain it will establish the convoy even though it has a mediterranean port.

Generalisimo · Mar 12, 2003

Originally posted by Wineman
Regarding RSI and german controlled parts of Italy. Have you considered the supply question for those German frontier provinces? This as they are cut-off from Germany by the RSI and Germany has no way of sending convoys unless it owns toulon or marseille or split. Especially in case of a AI played Germany, as I am not certain it will establish the convoy even though it has a mediterranean port.

yes, he is right, i think it is better to give Bolzano province to Germany (was a national claim of Germany) and then the rest to RSI.

unmerged(2826) · Mar 12, 2003

Maybe you could somehow use the suggestions I posted before...

Generalisimo · Mar 12, 2003

this:

#5: Italy surrenders:
--------------------------
IF Italy=Axis
AND
IF controlled by Allies wich= Tripoli, Benghazi,Messina, Siracusa, Taranto,Bari,Napoli, Cosenza,Potenza

choice A: Away with the German intruders! Viva Italia!

secede provinces wich= North of Italy,Albania,Balkan/Aegean possesions to Germany, Ethiopian holdings to UK, Tunisia to Free French, Libya divided between Free French and UK
form_new_cabinet(Prime Minister=Badoglio, don't know about others)
sleep some real facists
leave_alliance wich=Axis
join_alliance wich= Allies
give_military_acces to: UK, USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South-Africa,Belgium, Netherlands,Free French
Dow: Axis
(Germany gets a 5% dissent hit; other event)

choice B: We will stick closely to our German friends and allies.
dissent +5%
(Germany gives Toulon,Grenoble and Corsica to Italy; other event)

i prefer to have the RSI, like McNaughton, but i want to hear what people have to said about that before including it.

McNaughton · Mar 12, 2003

Italy Surrenders

Well, I am finishing up the final touches on the Italy Surrenders event, however, I have created two events. One that has an active RSI (with units, government, territory, etc.) and one that is abstracted into Germany (which gives territory and 4 militia units to the German army).

So, we can test to see how well the AI fights with an RSI or with a phantom RSI. I will send it out later today, as there are just a few little details I am cleaning up in these events.

I think that we should have both events (but if we use a configure tool give players the option of using one over the other), but have the phantom RSI as the default, as the German AI will probably fight better if it controlls everything (vs having an RSI puppet). However, if there is a German Human player I think that they could easily fight an Italian war with a real RSI, as they can set up convoys and supply.

I did do a small test of the real RSI, and was able to advance fairly far just using the Allied Italian military units. I got stopped at the border of Italy and Germany by Croatian and German units (however, I don't know if they would have driven through RSI Italy to meet me at the front lines as I encountered them at their border just at the time that they arrived there). I will do a few more tests as Allied Italy against the AI with a real RSI, some very aggressive, some not too aggressive.

It may be that we might have to modify the German AI so they see some Northern Italian provinces as core provinces to defend, even without having a real RSI. So a German_Italy.ai is probably needed, as I rarely remember the Germans ever sending forces to defend Itlay in HoI (leaving it up to just Italy who only surrendered when their nation was overrun).

I could also increase the delay that ocurrs from when Italy leaves the Axis and joins the Allies. This might give the Germans time to reinforce Italy, as they were given a few days grace to send in formations and demobilize Italian forces before the Allies were able to do anything.

unmerged(2826) · Mar 12, 2003

This is what I think should happen for Italy:
If all Ethiopian provinces, Eritrea and Somalia are controlled by the allies Ethiopia would be reinstated. It would receive it's old territory while Eritrea and Somalia would go to the UK and Ethiopia would join the allies, give up military access,...
If the allies control Taranto,Messina, Siracusa, Cosenza, Tripoli, Tobruk and Benghazi this would create the split of Italy: Libya is split between France and the UK, the Ethiopia event happens, these provinces become an allied Italy (mil. access+ UK, US and Canada create a supply line) all north of it would automatically go to the Germans, except for Torino and Milan wich would form the RSI (this is to allow the Germans to defend the coasts, draw supply lines,...) also Albania would go to the Germans. This then triggers the creation of the Gustav-line (Roma-Ancona?) and once the allies capture Napoli the creation of the Gothic line (Bolonga?). If the RSI would ever be puppeted or annexed it would automatically go to Italy. Do you like this better???

C.O.R.E HOI - Italy

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