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C.O.R.E. HOI - Naval Mod

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MateDow said:
I can find no data on an Ecuadoran ship named Presidente Alfaro for the time period of 1906 to 1946. The only ships in the Ecuadoran navy that I can find are the gunboats Libertudor Bolivar (ex-Almirante Simpson) which was scrapped in 1932. She was an ex-Chilean gunboat of 800 tons. The other gunboat was the Cotopaxi which was built in 1884 and discarded in 1932. I can probably do some more research on the two of them, but they don't appear to be the ones that you are looking for.

This is what I found on the Rosario-class river gunboats. Two ships completed in 1908 of 1055 tons. They were armed with two 152mm (6 inch) howiters and 6 76mm (3 inch) guns. They had a draft (draught) of 14 feet for working on rivers (4.3m (14 feet)). They were bought to patrol the rivers along the Brazilian and Paraguayan borders. They were both scrapped in the late 1950s.

In my opinion, the Argentine gunboats aren't suitable for CORE due to their shallow draft and riverine nature. I can't find anything about the Ecuadoran ships so I have to assume that they were pretty small or not available in the time period that we are dealing with. MDow
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Wow, 14 feet! That is shallow! I guess they won't be in the game then!
 
Semi-Lobster said:
MateDow, I was wondering if the Hashidate class should be changed from a 500t destroyer model to... well anything else. The fact they wheren't event close to 500t makes it sort of weird!

Also does anybody know the stats for the Chasan/Khasan class Soviet monitor? These aren't the usually small river monitors, here's a picture:
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Soviets had some interesting vessels it their river flotillas, they were also actively using those ships on both western and eastern fronts. Western part of their river vessels was mostly groupped in Dnieper Flottilla, later moved to Pinsk and Danube Flotillas, lost in 1941 (recreated later in 1944-45). In the east, Amur Flottilla supported actively Soviet Manchuria Offensive in 1945.

Still, I can hardly find a way to represent it in game - those ships were supporting land units on the tactical level, not on the operational one. It's something not really fitting HoI scale (just like armoured trains, super-heavy siege artillery and other unique weapons).
 
Copper Nicus said:
Soviets had some interesting vessels it their river flotillas, they were also actively using those ships on both western and eastern fronts. Western part of their river vessels was mostly groupped in Dnieper Flottilla, later moved to Pinsk and Danube Flotillas, lost in 1941 (recreated later in 1944-45). In the east, Amur Flottilla supported actively Soviet Manchuria Offensive in 1945.

Still, I can hardly find a way to represent it in game - those ships were supporting land units on the tactical level, not on the operational one. It's something not really fitting HoI scale (just like armoured trains, super-heavy siege artillery and other unique weapons).
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I think you quoted the wrong thing Copper! :D

I guess your right, too bad about that, it would have been a nice way to represent them in the game. Well it was just an idea! :)
 
Semi-Lobster said:
I think you quoted the wrong thing Copper! :D

I guess your right, too bad about that, it would have been a nice way to represent them in the game. Well it was just an idea! :)
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Just a thought:

Could you represent them thru a USSR only Naval Doctrine, giving a river crossing/combat bonus to SU troops?
 
Der Bismarck said:
Just a thought:

Could you represent them thru a USSR only Naval Doctrine, giving a river crossing/combat bonus to SU troops?
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The Soviets weren't the only country to use them. The Manchurian government used heavily armed gunboats on the Amur River, but they didn't have any effect on the outcome. I believe they surrendered to the attacking Soviets without a fight. Poland also operated some of these ships. The Krakow-class river monitors were used at the beginning of the war, but they too weren't able to effect the outcome. The Krakow was scuttled on the Prypec river and later raised by the Soviets and recommisioned. The Wilno was blown up to prevent capture.

If this was to be a tech, it wouldn't be limited to the Soviets because of the numerous countries that operated them. But if Copper says that they are a tactical weapon, then I respect his decision. I don't know enough about their effect on land combat to make that call. I know that none of them are capable of operating outside of rivers so they can't be included as high seas units. MDow
 
Yah, combined with the very high river defence bonus/penalty it would make crossing rivers impossible unfortunatly. And of course, it's too tactical and HoI isn't very good at handling things on that level
 
Semi-Lobster said:
MateDow, I was wondering if the Hashidate class should be changed from a 500t destroyer model to... well anything else. The fact they wheren't event close to 500t makes it sort of weird!

Also does anybody know the stats for the Chasan/Khasan class Soviet monitor? These aren't the usually small river monitors, here's a picture:

rys-chasan.jpg
Click to expand...

Hasan class river monitors.
Three ships of this class were laid down on 18 april 1936 -"Sibirtzev", "Seryshev" and "Lazo". Later renamed to "Hasan", "Perekop" and "Sivash". "Hasan" launched on 30.08.1940, commissioned on 26.12.1942.
2400t., 4 diesel engines, 15 knots, armour - side 75mm, deck - 40mm. Dimensions - 88,3x11,1x2,8
Armament: 6x130mm, 4x76mm, 6x45mm.
Did not participate in war. After 1945 - training ships.
hasan.jpg
 
Crazyhorse said:
Nice site Bismarck! Didn't know this one!

MAteDow,

Akready had a chance to look at the passenger liners for the Dutch OOB?
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I have had a chance and am adding it into the 0.81 OOB for the Netherlands. They will get an additional three Liner Companies: Holland Amerika Lijn, Rotterdamsche Lloyd, and Nederland Line. They will mostly get small passenger liners except for the Holland Amerika which will get large passenger liners for the Rotterdam IV and the Statendam III. I have kept all of the liners that were larger than 15000 tons that I could find. MDow
 
MateDow said:
I have had a chance and am adding it into the 0.81 OOB for the Netherlands. They will get an additional three Liner Companies: Holland Amerika Lijn, Rotterdamsche Lloyd, and Nederland Line. They will mostly get small passenger liners except for the Holland Amerika which will get large passenger liners for the Rotterdam IV and the Statendam III. I have kept all of the liners that were larger than 15000 tons that I could find. MDow
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Thanks. That seems perfect! :)
 
Steel said:
So do you guys have any good naval OOBs for 1939? :D
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With the number of changes that have been made to the models we are still playing catch-up for 1936. Those are almost done, and then we can get started on 1939. MDow
 
MateDow said:
With the number of changes that have been made to the models we are still playing catch-up for 1936. Those are almost done, and then we can get started on 1939. MDow
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Good stuff :) If you need extra manpower then ask for it, I'm sure there's regular contributors to this thread as well as lurkers who can assist... it's a big job!
 
MateDow, I'm wondering if the treaty sloop and small light cruiser models would have had to be built after 1930. I'm trying to figure out where to put the French Pluton cruiser-minelayer (4773 t - 6500 t) but I have no idea if it should stay a protected cruiser or bumped up to treaty sloop, maybe even just a light cruiser
 
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Semi-Lobster said:
MateDow, I'm wondering if the treaty sloop and small light cruiser models would have had to be built after 1930. I'm trying to figure out where to put the French Pluton cruiser-minelayer (4773 t - 6500 t) but I have no idea if it should stay a protected cruiser or bumped up to treaty sloop, maybe even just a light cruiser
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Having just finished France for 1936, this is what I came up with...

Code: 
	division = {
		id = { type = 28008 id = 132 }
		name = "Pluton"
		type = cruiser
		model = 6
		seaattack = 3
		maxspeed = 30
		}

I figure that will make her fairly realistic.

Awhile back you asked of I could put in the Pollux and Castor. They appear to be minelayers, but I can't find any reference to them from 1905 to 1947. What country are they from? I will put them in, but I don't know where they go :confused:. MDow
 
The Pollux and Castor are French minelayers, I surprised you don't know about them, they where even mentioned by name in the Washington Naval Conference (because the Castor exceeded 3000 t but they let France keep them). The Castor was 3,150 t, had an armament of 4 × 100mm, 2 × 37mm and 368 mines and had a top speed of 14.5 knots. During WWII she was captured by the Italians and renamed FR 60. The Pollux was 2,460 t, had an armament of 4 × 100mm, 2 × 37mm and 234 mines and also had a top speed of 14.5 knots. In 03.07.1940 she was captured by the British, survived the war and was returned to France in 1946
 
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