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TheMeInTeam said:
Especially considering that they will usually take, at most 3 and often just 2 provinces before refusing based on overextension, and indeed the coring time vs annexing is trivial.
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FYI it is not "at most 3 and often just 2 provinces." Vassals ALWAYS stop accepting land due to overextension at EXACTLY 24% overextension. This means that vassals will accept 6 cumulative base tax and no more. The nice thing about this is they will always accept more land (provided they want it) if they have anything less than 24%.


For example, say you attack the Mamluks and take 6, 1 base tax, provinces. Your vassal, say tripoli, will accept all 6 of them (again provided same culture or same religion). Now suppose, however, you take 5, 1 base tax provinces, and 1, 7 base tax province, such as Cairo. If you feed the vassal the 5 1 base tax provinces first, the vassal will be at 20% overextension and will accept the 7 base tax province. However, if you feed it the 7 base tax province first, they will be at 28% overextension and will therefore not accept any of the 1 base tax provinces.

5 base tax + 14 base tax = OK

6 base tax + 2 base tax = FAIL

1 base tax + 4 base tax + 17 base tax = OK

I hope this is clear.

Plan your land grabs accordingly.
 
Stategem161803 said:
FYI it is not "at most 3 and often just 2 provinces." Vassals ALWAYS stop accepting land due to overextension at EXACTLY 24% overextension. This means that vassals will accept 6 cumulative base tax and no more. The nice thing about this is they will always accept more land (provided they want it) if they have anything less than 24%.


For example, say you attack the Mamluks and take 6, 1 base tax, provinces. Your vassal, say tripoli, will accept all 6 of them (again provided same culture or same religion). Now suppose, however, you take 5, 1 base tax provinces, and 1, 7 base tax province, such as Cairo. If you feed the vassal the 5 1 base tax provinces first, the vassal will be at 20% overextension and will accept the 7 base tax province. However, if you feed it the 7 base tax province first, they will be at 28% overextension and will therefore not accept any of the 1 base tax provinces.

5 base tax + 14 base tax = OK

6 base tax + 2 base tax = FAIL

1 base tax + 4 base tax + 17 base tax = OK

I hope this is clear.

Plan your land grabs accordingly.
Click to expand...

Interesting information. Thanks :)
 
Demetrios of M said:
@ panionios: Amazingly so, yes I am sure that Manuel von Hapsburg is ruling both countries from Constantinople, i.e. Austria is the lesser part in the PU. I have no idea why though. Efharisto (thank you) for the reply.
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...von Hapsburg is the Austrian dynasty. Doesn't that mean the Austrians are ruling Byzantium?

If you click on Austria's diplomacy, you will see that Manuel von Hapsburg is in charge there, too.

Maybe I'm just confused.
 
SweetHalcyHS said:
Actually this is rarely a consideration unless you've fed a subject quite heavily; the integration process will in most cases far outlast the time to core.
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TheMeInTeam said:
Especially considering that they will usually take, at most 3 and often just 2 provinces before refusing based on overextension, and indeed the coring time vs annexing is trivial.
Click to expand...

You're right that usually you'll be OK. But you should always check, because it's not guaranteed:
  1. On several occasions I've seen subject nations that did not start coring a province for a long time after I sold it to them. In one case, it was years. I checked into that further and found that they weren't even coring it when they had enough admin points. I'm not sure what the AI is prioritising, but there's certainly cases where they can't afford to core immediately, and cases where they can afford it but apparently want to save their admin points for something else.
  2. It's also possible to have coring take longer than integration. Especially when you, the Overlord, has a lot of DipRep, and they the subject are quite large.
Consider the following:

It's 13th June 1598, and this is the completion date for a just-started integration of Spain, my PU minor:

8fnDB19.png



As a test I sold them Toulouse a few days before I started integrating. Then I tag switched to them to see how long the coring would take:

lw9jjrM.png



This is an amusing example, because integration will complete four days before the coring would have. When integration says March 1604, it means March 1st. So I would lose out on a cored Toulouse by four days! The province must be cored at time of integration completion else you get no core; any coring progress is lost.

I didn't have to go out of my way to show this, I just took my current game and sold one province to my PU minor and started the integration. That said, it certainly won't be the norm. Nonetheless you should always double check that provinces you've sold them have started coring, and, particularly in cases where your subject is large (usually meaning it's a PU), check or at least estimate how long that coring will take. Remember that coring time scales with nation size, and can take as long as 20 years.

It's easy enough to check so no reason to risk it!
 
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TheBloke said:
Remember that coring time scales with nation size, and can take as long as 20 years.
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FYI, the formula for this is defined as follows:

In common/defines.lua, these:

Code: 
    CORE_TIME_SIZE_MODIFIER = 0.04,          -- % longer per province owned.
    MONTHS_TO_CORE_MAXIMUM = 240,
    MONTHS_TO_CORE = 36,                        -- How many months it will take to core a province.

The Wiki has a good explanation at: http://www.eu4wiki.com/Coring#Duration

Quoting their example: "As an example, at 100 province it would take 3 * (1+100*0.04) = 15 years to core a single province."

In my example with Spain in PU, they have 64 provinces (after I sold them one). This gives them a coring time of 7.8 years, which is 7 years, 9 months, and 18 days.
 
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dharper said:
...von Hapsburg is the Austrian dynasty. Doesn't that mean the Austrians are ruling Byzantium?

If you click on Austria's diplomacy, you will see that Manuel von Hapsburg is in charge there, too.

Maybe I'm just confused.
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It's possible that he as Byzantium got the Austrian dynasty earlier on, and then later Austria had no heir and fell into PU under him.

I agree the gut reaction would be to think that Austria was the master, but the OP was certain that he was the PU master.
 
roman566 said:
How do you abandon a colony?
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Remove the colonist and it won't cost you any money, and eventually will likely be destroyed by rebels.

That's the only way I know of that's under your control. It could also get seized or burnt during a war.

If it's non-Ironman and you want to cheat, you can use the Console to run: revolt <provinceID> to trigger rebels immediately who will kill the settlers and eventually turn it back to unsettled land.

Use this list to get the Province ID - http://www.eu4wiki.com/List_of_provinces or play with the second mod in my signature, which adds ProvinceID to every province name (requires you start a new game, doesn't work for existing ones yet.)
 
I just had 2 allies flick over from friendly to hostile with no negative modifiers against either. I share a border with one but not the other. Anything I can do to avoid this or is the diplomatic behavior just bad on the current patch?.
 
diceyy said:
I just had 2 allies flick over from friendly to hostile with no negative modifiers against either. I share a border with one but not the other. Anything I can do to avoid this or is the diplomatic behavior just bad on the current patch?.
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Sometimes the ai wants something from you, so they will become hostile. For instance, if you hold French cores, nothing can stop the french from hating you. Other times, they just want to eat you just like sometimes you just want to eat an AI nation. The best way to ensure a long and friendly alliance is not to hold their cores, attack their enemies, answer calls to war, and build trust.

If you are weak and rich, expect to be destroyed. Wouldn't you do the same?
 
Stategem161803 said:
Sometimes the ai wants something from you, so they will become hostile. For instance, if you hold French cores, nothing can stop the french from hating you. Other times, they just want to eat you just like sometimes you just want to eat an AI nation. The best way to ensure a long and friendly alliance is not to hold their cores, attack their enemies, answer calls to war, and build trust.

If you are weak and rich, expect to be destroyed. Wouldn't you do the same?
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I've seen the same thing with Scotland. They're my friends (relation over +100), RM and allies. I'm quietly minding my own business, annexing a vassal in Ireland, and <bam> hostile, rivals, relations -50. Now granted, I was England, so that might have something to do with it, but still, I had not so much as overcharged a single bottle of Whiskey since the start of the game.
 
misterbean said:
I've seen the same thing with Scotland. They're my friends (relation over +100), RM and allies. I'm quietly minding my own business, annexing a vassal in Ireland, and <bam> hostile, rivals, relations -50. Now granted, I was England, so that might have something to do with it, but still, I had not so much as overcharged a single bottle of Whiskey since the start of the game.
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But you have, albeit not doing so deliberately with regards to Scotland. The Scots wanted that Irish whisky (presumably so they could destroy it to create a premium on Scotch Whisky), and now you have it and you can no longer be BFFs.

To be fair you've had it rather good so far, to keep them sweet so long. Take this opportunity to vassalise them with a view to later integration and GBR formation :)

For anyone playing non-Ironman, who wants to check out what the AI is thinking, open the Console and type: aiview

Then whenever you hover over the flag of any AI nation, it shows a long tooltip indicating their dreams, ambitions, fears, and who they secretly have a crush on.

Specific to this discussion, it will show you which nations and provinces they want to conquer, how Threatened they are by certain nations, and how Hostile they are towards them.

Here's an example:
5ppikh0.png
 
Stategem161803 said:
FYI it is not "at most 3 and often just 2 provinces." Vassals ALWAYS stop accepting land due to overextension at EXACTLY 24% overextension. This means that vassals will accept 6 cumulative base tax and no more. The nice thing about this is they will always accept more land (provided they want it) if they have anything less than 24%.


For example, say you attack the Mamluks and take 6, 1 base tax, provinces. Your vassal, say tripoli, will accept all 6 of them (again provided same culture or same religion). Now suppose, however, you take 5, 1 base tax provinces, and 1, 7 base tax province, such as Cairo. If you feed the vassal the 5 1 base tax provinces first, the vassal will be at 20% overextension and will accept the 7 base tax province. However, if you feed it the 7 base tax province first, they will be at 28% overextension and will therefore not accept any of the 1 base tax provinces.

5 base tax + 14 base tax = OK

6 base tax + 2 base tax = FAIL

1 base tax + 4 base tax + 17 base tax = OK

I hope this is clear.

Plan your land grabs accordingly.
Click to expand...

I see, thanks for the clarification. Regardless, the larger limiting factor seems to be culture/religion walls. Still, it's useful to know base tax limitations because it can help to capture and even give them provinces in a different order.
 
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