Genocide mechanics

[Cephei80]

At the very least I would expect there to be smallpox or whatever to go through the new world to weaken its states. I was thinking of a "genocide button" that just deletes pops. That would be silly but there are better ways to handle that I guess (like expelling population.)

yeah , maybe war by itself can do the deal . like if they are 5000 peoples and you fight them in a war then conquer them you could basically put them on extinction list like how in stellaris you could nearly wipe out a specy without the need of purge button .
since this game have wars that affect the population directly then i think its possible for oceanic natives for example to face severe danger by any invading army that land on them

 

[Friedrich von Deutschland]

At the very least I would expect there to be smallpox or whatever to go through the new world to weaken its states. I was thinking of a "genocide button" that just deletes pops. That would be silly but there are better ways to handle that I guess (like expelling population.)

It's called the "great pox". It spawns as part of the columbian exchange and should kill 50-90% of the new world population.

 

[haemoarch]

i believe what hadrian did was an ethnically centered systematic genocide, and even if paradox does not add genocide to the game as a mechanic, a mod of it will be shared in discord channels in a couple of days after release.

 

[Sirbab]

It's called the "great pox". It spawns as part of the columbian exchange and should kill 50-90% of the new world population.

Mind you, that should be ~50% in one region, and ~90% in another. I'm quite certain inland north America was hit less badly than say the carib peoples.

 

[Friedrich von Deutschland]

Mind you, that should be ~50% in one region, and ~90% in another. I'm quite certain inland north America was hit less badly than say the carib peoples.

I'm just going off what the devs said, that the Great Pox would kill between 50 75 and 90% of pops. For reference they said 30-60% for the Black Death.

 

[Rule Britannia]

I for one want a prima nocta government reform

 

[AHumpierRogue]

Genocide is unnecessary for the game IMO. I do think specific targetted Expulsion mechanics are needed though. Both to say "outside our sphere"(so saying to leave the country and any subjects)as with Iberian jews and also specific targetted migrations to your subjects, like kicking heretics out to the colonies. Expulsion in general also seems somewhat more palatable than just killing pops.

 

[kagami1999]

Genocide is unnecessary for the game IMO. I do think specific targetted Expulsion mechanics are needed though. Both to say "outside our sphere"(so saying to leave the country and any subjects)as with Iberian jews and also specific targetted migrations to your subjects, like kicking heretics out to the colonies. Expulsion in general also seems somewhat more palatable than just killing pops.

Honestly, expulsion is a good middle ground. You no longer have to deal with troublesome minorities, but at the same time, this action could strengthen your enemies (your pops flee to their lands and increase their tax/recruitment base).

 

[PortDoubloon01]

Genocide is unnecessary for the game IMO. I do think specific targetted Expulsion mechanics are needed though. Both to say "outside our sphere"(so saying to leave the country and any subjects)as with Iberian jews and also specific targetted migrations to your subjects, like kicking heretics out to the colonies. Expulsion in general also seems somewhat more palatable than just killing pops.

Agreed. Resettlement was vastly more common. I understand some people want to map paint culture.

I just challenge anyone to point to multiple instances of genocide from 1340-1820 that are not:
1) Expulsion (already partially modeled, could be improved to target minorities)
2) Sporadic low level violence
3) Pillaging during war

You're just going to be able to point to anti-Jewish pograms, which mostly resulted in expulsion. We shouldn't have a mechanic for something that didn't exist historically.

I also challenge people to point to central government assimilation programs that didn't center around immigration or emigration to justify the assimilation cabinet action. That didn't happen, nationalism didn't exist yet and states didn't have the capacity to change the culture of thousands of peasants in decades. You're going to find the French public school program at the end game, which could be represented by buildings.

Again, I understand people want to map paint culture, I just don't think we should have cultural erasure mechanics that didn't exist historically. To change culture in an area we should be limited to resettlement, and perhaps assimilation/conversion buffs from buildings like schools/churches and/or discriminatory laws/privileges.

 

[Hoekie98]

Honestly, expulsion is a good middle ground. You no longer have to deal with troublesome minorities, but at the same time, the action could potentially strengthen your enemies (if your pops flee to their lands).

It would indeed be a nice fast but bad option to get rid of unaccepted cultures and religions. I bet it should anger relations between cultures and countries representing those cultures and religions. Maybe also cause other minority cultures to become unhappy and weary.

An actual kill people button won't ever happen outside of mods. I also don't think that will be necessary.

 

[Hoekie98]

It would indeed be a nice fast but bad option to get rid of unaccepted cultures and religions. I bet it should anger relations between cultures and countries representing those cultures and religions. Maybe also cause other minority cultures to become unhappy and weary.

An actual kill people button won't ever happen outside of mods. I also don't think that will be necessary.

Additionally I don't think you should have a council option for faster assimilation, perhaps you could instead have it focus the conversion on a specific culture or religion?

 

[kagami1999]

It would indeed be a nice fast but bad option to get rid of unaccepted cultures and religions. I bet it should anger relations between cultures and countries representing those cultures and religions. Maybe also cause other minority cultures to become unhappy and weary.

An actual kill people button won't ever happen outside of mods. I also don't think that will be necessary.

I could see some cool events stemming from this decision, like refugee pops form raiding parties and cause trouble along the border with the country that expelled them.

 

[Cephei80]

Genocide is unnecessary for the game IMO. I do think specific targetted Expulsion mechanics are needed though. Both to say "outside our sphere"(so saying to leave the country and any subjects)as with Iberian jews and also specific targetted migrations to your subjects, like kicking heretics out to the colonies. Expulsion in general also seems somewhat more palatable than just killing pops.

expulsions is likely in or else how will it work in iberia ? the ck2 decision should also be in game for free 300 gold *wink wink*

 

[Sharkseant]

i definetly agree with most takes here. There needs to be some amount of local Genocide in the game perhabs as an higher decrease in Population if it affects pop of a different culturegroup or Faith

additionally Expelltion of specific cultures from Land should be a thing.

 

[Dongerino]

 

[Hoekie98]

It would indeed be a nice fast but bad option to get rid of unaccepted cultures and religions. I bet it should anger relations between cultures and countries representing those cultures and religions. Maybe also cause other minority cultures to become unhappy and weary.

An actual kill people button won't ever happen outside of mods. I also don't think that will be necessary.

Additionally I don't think you should have a council option for faster assimilation, perhaps you could instead have it focus the conversion on a specific culture or religion?

 

[themoomaster]

Yes, we get it, you find it funny to post "How do I genocide in Paradox game???"

these posts are getting old. I don't even care if they're genuine or trying to get screencapped for a reddit post

 

[GeneralNoob]

I just want to add 2 things:

1. This topic was already discussed in another thread.

2. Increasing your culture and making it dominant is relatively fast. So the entire discussion here is about "how can I kill minorities, even though they dont impact me in any meaningfully negative way?". It is beyond me, why some people feel like we absolutely need a genocide mechanic. Historic or not. Is this some kind of power-fantasy?

 

[stateki]

I just want to add 2 things:

1. This topic was already discussed in another thread.

2. Increasing your culture and making it dominant is relatively fast. So the entire discussion here is about "how can I kill minorities, even though they dont impact me in any meaningfully negative way?". It is beyond me, why some people feel like we absolutely need a genocide mechanic. Historic or not. Is this some kind of power-fantasy?

Yeah i want to be able to kill people that i hate

 

[AHumpierRogue]

expulsions is likely in or else how will it work in iberia ? the ck2 decision should also be in game for free 300 gold *wink wink*

I think that is very likely to be handled via event, honestly. I don't think Expulsion is actually going to happen even if forced resettlement and expulsions were a thing in the period. I think whats far more likely is that only major atrocities that historically ocurred will be represented and it will be via "event" so the player will not actually be able to do them as they will, but rather it will be provided by the game only in super specific circumstances(such as the expulsion of the Iberian Jews). That seems the most likely to me by half for Paradox to go with since it keeps such topics to a minimum and out of the players hands.

Yeah i want to be able to kill people that i hate

Wow, great fourth post on the forums! Keep it up champ!

This is why topics cannot be discussed with any sort of seriousness.