No physical release

[unmerged(6881)]

It doesn't make sense to produce boxed edition of niche game like EU.

Me_ - your logic is sound when boxed copies are already there and business thinks hard how to minimise losses, recoup costs, use old product for marketing goals or simply let it live through another chain of sales (budget lines and so on).

It does not apply to digital only product where there is no initial cost to recoup. Last but not least, you can still use promotions heavily and you are never going to drop below production cost treshold. This means that promotion policy cane be much more flexible which in turn maximises sales.

There is strong marketing role of cheap older product floated in baskets or 2nd-hand sales but that can be replaced by similar price drops in digital (Steam sales) and improved visibility in the net.

It all depends on customers habits - do they still visit brick and mortar shops and sate their curiosity for trying new, cheap product there or do they go for Steam sales?

 

[Mr. Capiatlist]

Piracy can lead to sales though...

Look how many games I have from Paradox.

Yes, I must confess that the first PDox games I played were pirated. But I buy what I like so...

Protip: That was not the smartest thing to say.

 

[tapewormlondon]

One advantage of physical sales is the advertisement factor. I found out about EU3 when I saw it in a shop. How are you going to reach new customers with Digital only releases? Not saying it is not possible, but I'm curious.

Advertising online whether it be through actual adverts, sales on steam, ads on steam, word of mouth through forums, reviews etc. I got introduced to Paradox on the CiV forums. Digital is way easier to promote and get in front of a purchaser than putting it in a shop.

Hell I have lost count of the number of random purchases i have made digitally just on impulse

 

[Mr. Capiatlist]

Hell I have lost count of the number of random purchases i have made digitally just on impulse

How do you think the steam summer sale works? Every year I end up with like 15 games that I'll only play once... But for $10 who cares?

 

[Sn3ipen]

Honey can you hide my wallet. There's a new patch for CK2 and I have to log into Steam.

Seriously. Those sales have both a good and a bad side. I have discovered lots of games this way and they have left some bad taste in my mouth to. Swearing that next time, I will control myself and remain calm.

 

[Franconian]

Honey can you hide my wallet. There's a new patch for CK2 and I have to log into Steam.

Seriously. Those sales have both a good and a bad side. I have discovered lots of games this way and they have left some bad taste in my mouth to. Swearing that next time, I will control myself and remain calm.

I say that every year and I am every year on a diet until the next pay.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

As long as this won't mean a 5 page manual, it's gonna be fine.

Good luck with that -- CK II didn't even get a manual.

 

[Sn3ipen]

Good luck with that -- CK II didn't even get a manual.

Here you go:

An official CK2 manual in 60 pages and in 4 different Languages. You need to have the game registered on the forum to open that link, though.

You can find it in the FAQ underforum at the CK2 forum.

Edit: I was looking for it in Steam and couldn't find it there anymore. EU3 have its manual in my Steam library but CK2 does not.

 

[Sleight of Hand]

Yeah, obviously I've read that; it doesn't really tell you much. it's a very brief overview of the game and an appendix of traits.

(I actually thought it was called a quickstart guide -- apologies).

 

[flame7926]

Yeah, obviously I've read that; it doesn't really tell you much. it's a very brief overview of the game and an appendix of traits.

(I actually thought it was called a quickstart guide -- apologies).

There was also the user guide made.

 

[FOARP]

Currently, physical copies are a tiny fraction of what they was just a few years ago. Lots of markets have stopped with boxed copies, as the RoI is negative.

I can see the logic behind this. As a guy who works in intellectual property, and who used to live in China, I know that hard-copies are vector #1 whereby games/film/music escape onto torrenting sites thus killing sales. One of things that makes where I live (Poland) seem a bit old-fashioned is that the shops here still stock boxed PC games, which disappeared from UK stores ~5 years ago. I'll be flattering and say this is because by-and-large the Poles pirate less.

I won't miss the boxed copies on sale now though - the ones that come in what they call a "Keep Case" - because they're nowhere near the kind of substantial, gloriously decorated shoe-box sized things that I used to excitedly unwrap under the christmas tree every year, each containing a novel-sized hand-book and a set of floppies.

The only thing I would say is that boxed copies do still act as a form of advertising, albeit an expensive kind.

EDIT: The first paradox game I ever played (HOI1 - a proper boxed copy of the type described above) was a chance purchase from a second-hand shop. I only found out that HOI2 was on sale when I saw it in HMV in Victoria station in London. These days, however, are gone - I am now a confessed but helpless adict of the Paradox forum!

 

[suplanter]

i remember reading some where that game companies lose more money off of resale of physical copies than they do from pirated stuff. it really didnt make sense to make physical since the market was small and they would lose out later as the life of the game waned and those paying customers werent paying them for a product they were still selling.

 

[fenwayb]

What you suggested requires them to actually MAKE the boxed copy, however. If they decide to not make any box copy at all, the cost to Paradox is $0. So if someone pirates it, yes they don't gain a sell, but Paradox didn't make anything.

Now, if you suggest that Paradox goes and makes a new box for $15 and then sells it for $10, they have only lost $5. This is less useful unless you think that doing this will recoup the costs with other, future sales.

but he isn't arguing that Paradox should make boxed copies; He, and I, were simply saying that it's not really fair to essentially tell people that if they bought the game on sale, then they're actually worse than pirates (which what "you might as well pirate it" implies).

 

[James The 1st]

but he isn't arguing that Paradox should make boxed copies; He, and I, were simply saying that it's not really fair to essentially tell people that if they bought the game on sale, then they're actually worse than pirates (which what "you might as well pirate it" implies).

It could sound like Johan was implying it, but I highly doubt he actually meant that.

 

[fenwayb]

It could sound like Johan was implying it, but I highly he actually meant that.

I highly doubt he meant that either, but it was still not the right thing to say.

 

[Hootieleece]

They were already headed towards digital only.I bought CKII boxed game direct from them.(It came in mail about 3 weeks after first day of sale)It required me to install Steam to load and run the game.I'm not to happy with digital download only or Steam but just call me old fashioned.

 

[T.j. Arnold]

As long as this won't mean a 5 page manual, it's gonna be fine.

Or, like Valve, a one-page insert that is just the key-bindings.

 

[Jayavarman]

He, and I, were simply saying that it's not really fair to essentially tell people that if they bought the game on sale, then they're actually worse than pirates (which what "you might as well pirate it" implies).

Agree. I need Johan's approval of my purchasing habits so that I can stop crying on my pillow at night.

 

[Garak]

Meh, Paradox games are impossible to find in stores already. I mentioned it in another thread, but I'll bring it up again; I haven't been able to get a physical copy of a Paradox game since Rome. It's a shame, because I do vastly prefer physical copies (for one, I can read whatever damn documentation comes with it; I just can't sit in front of my screen and read a manual in a pdf file or whatever), and I did first learn about Paradox by spotting EU3 in a store entirely by chance. But, that's the way things are going. Shelf space for PC games is at a premium, thanks to the consoles hogging all the space in the stores. The local Gamestop I shop at had a whole wall section for PC games up until not that long ago. Now, they've been shuffled off to a single rack towards the back of the store. I can see why a relatively small, less well-known company like Paradox would have trouble getting enough space to make it worth the expense. I don't like the fact that this is how things are, but there's no sense arguing about it.

 

[JakopDalunde]

First, seems more likely that Johan was talking about economics, not morals.

Second, if you just wanna enjoy the game as cheaply as possible - go ahead and buy the game at bargain bin or a super-sale. There's nothing wrong with it.

But you want Paradox to keep doing these amazing games and invest in more development capabilities - then its far better to pre-order or buy at release. In the long run we get what we pay for.