• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Well that wouldn't be charging....

Just to respond as well as the post was a response to me.

It would be.
It's clearly a charge.
If it's free at any other point later on is irrelevant.

Sure if you'd ask the Ministry of Truth using newspeak, then that might be different...

No worries, i won't comment any further on this (hopefully). :D:p
 
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Possibly, although such copies are either quickly spotted or don't get very far when it comes to the PDS workshop.
Outside workshop can be more problematic yes.
 
Outside workshop can be more problematic yes.
Definitely, but for those instances they would already have donations or even charge for mods in complete disregard for the rules listed here. So I'm not sure the problem outside official platforms will change with this rule change, since the rules in question are to be respected on the forums and the Steam Workshop.
 
Definitely, but for those instances they would already have donations or even charge for mods in complete disregard for the rules listed here. So I'm not sure the problem outside official platforms will change with this rule change, since the rules in question are to be respected on the forums and the Steam Workshop.
Paradox can enforce their intelectual property over the mods outside the PI forums and workshop.
 
Paradox can enforce their intelectual property over the mods outside the PI forums and workshop.
Of course, but it isn't a part of these rules:
Below are the rules you must follow if you want to Mention/Discuss/Plan or otherwise Market your User mod on our forums and or list it in the steam Workshop.
 
Of course, but it isn't a part of these rules:
This is i guess the implicit counterpart of the modders not being able to claim any IP over their content or publishing outside the forum and WS. PI is supposed to protect modders, even outside their direct control area, otherwise, there is no point is having such rules if anyone can steal and sell a mod elsewhere.
 
In fact, Pardox is quite reluctant to proof what is legal (or fair) and what is not.
Example for music mods using (possibly) other company's intellectual properties.

You seam to assume we are omniscient, thank-you for that, but we do not know who holds copyright on what, or who has permission to use what. How could we possibly.
Do you know who wrote the song and maybe the same person who gave permission to the TW Devs gave permission to the user, or maybe the song is PD, or maybe the user is the original author of the song and the one that licensed it to CA in the first place. I don't know, could you swear to any of those things?

We know what our IP is and seek to protect that, if other IP holders inform us of breaches we would act to assist them, but we cannot act out of assumptions.

Our rules state that one of the above cases must be true, until and unless we receive official word from a copyright holder to the contrary we will give our members the benefit of the doubt that they are not breaking our rules.

Theoretically the same thing could happen for mods, I am afraid. Heck, they even won't try to say "Hello, do you really have the permission of this contents?".
We can't over-expect that Paradox can protect us. We have to protect by ourselves (by ego-search and other methods).
 
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This is the discussion thread for the User Modding Rules of PDS Games. Please note that other games published by Paradox Interactive may be subject to other rules. For example the game Pillars of Eternity is owned by Obsidian Entertainment and you will need to contact Obsidian if you wish to mod that particular game.

If you want to read more about what can be done/not done with Paradox games as a whole, please visit our legal page: https://legal.paradoxplaza.com/terms-of-use

First, We at Paradox love User modding and mods for our games and want to encourage you to do so, we see benefits for everyone involved.
In the past there has been some confusion about the rules concerning user mods, in an effort to provide a clear understanding, the rules are formalized here.
These may be updated as needs and circumstances arise and through exchanges and dialog with you, our valued modders.

Below are the rules you must follow if you want to Mention/Discuss/Plan or otherwise Market your User mod on our forums and or list it in the steam Workshop.

1) Although we will no longer absolutely forbid having an external forum for the mod that is open to the general public (You have always been allowed a private one for the internal modding team), we strongly encourage you to keep your feedback discussions here to both benefit our members and to benefit from them. If you choose to have an external forum you can still use ours but normal rules against posting/direct linking/ or writing out external links without approval still apply.
2) User Mod files should be hosted on a file share site designed for use by the public (if they know the specific address) and or Steam Workshop.
3) The User Mod will not distribute the EXE file.
4) The User Mod may not include ANY kind of license or claim of copyright distributed with the mod (You may have a Credits section).
5) The User Mod should respect the work of other modders and not include any work without the consent of that modder.
6) The User Mod should not include 3rd party copyright material, without permission of the copyright holder.
7) Mods created with content owned by Paradox Interactive must be made so that they will only be usable by players who have the corresponding game or DLC installed. If this requirement is beyond the technical ability of the particular mod maker (or it is impossible due to the nature of said mod) then they cannot be used.
8) You may not charge to buy the mod or charge fees of any kind.
9) The Mod should be exclusive to the members of this forum and or Steam workshop.

Violations: If you feel that a user mod is violating one of these rules, please alert a Moderator and never bring it up publicly, leave that to the staff. Starting an argument or confronting the mod creator directly can result in unfriendly behavior and may result in both parties being warned or infracted, we do not want members getting into arguments about it Especially for Rule 5.

Once your User Mod has grown to the point where you feel you need more than one thread to discuss it, you can ask a Moderator that your main thread be stuck to the top of the forum and can use the first post of that thread to act as an index to the other related threads of your Mod.
Once you feel You have too many threads and posts to manage in that way, you can ask a Moderator to sponsor your mod and they can apply to an Administrator for your own sub forum.

It is important to note that we support modders and want you to succeed, follow the rules as outlined above and we will support you as fully as we are able.

SNEAKY EDIT:
Removed the following line: You may not solicit directly or indirectly donation in any form.
Our terms of use has been updated and you are allowed to include a link to Patreon (for example). If someone wants to donate for the time you've invested in creating your mod, that's fine, but make sure it follows rule 8 above.
Number 5 actually seems pretty ridiculous. You have to ask permission for use of anything? When does it stop, especially when it comes to sub mods of sub mods. Modifying it so that you must reference any work is just fine. Everything else seems like common sense.

Note, I am only referring submodding (mods in combination). Taking someone else's work and modifying it without permission is both disrespectful and should be noted as illegal in the community rules, unless you get permission.
 
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Number 5 actually seems pretty ridiculous. You have to ask permission for use of anything? When does it stop, especially when it comes to sub mods of sub mods. Modifying it so that you must reference any work is just fine. Everything else seems like common sense.
Actually it depends what you mean :
- if a player wants to make a submod of my mod, fine, as long as it's really a submod, not a stand-alone
- if a player wants to borrow files or a feature from my mod, then, the least i expect, is the decency and common sense to ask for permission and accept my decision
 
Actually it depends what you mean :
- if a player wants to make a submod of my mod, fine, as long as it's really a submod, not a stand-alone
- if a player wants to borrow files or a feature from my mod, then, the least i expect, is the decency and common sense to ask for permission and accept my decision
Exactly, but just using it without modifying (submod) is also included in the wording for illegal usage. That's why I think it's problematic.

It causes problems especially when there are sub mods of sub-mods. Who's permission do you need at that point? That was my original meaning. Usage (submodding) is one thing (just make sure to reference the mod you are using), Modifying another's work and passing it off as yours is something else entirely and should be included under illegal usage (in other words plagiarism).
 
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Exactly, but just using it without modifying (submod) is also included in the wording for illegal usage. That's why I think it's problematic.

It causes problems especially when there are sub mods of sub-mods. Who's permission do you need at that point? That was my original meaning. Usage (submodding) is one thing (just make sure to reference the mod you are using), Modifying another's work and passing it off as yours is something else entirely and should be included under illegal usage (in other words plagiarism).
The rule is about borrowing stuff from a mod. Submods just edits some files, but require the main mod to work.

Although, it does take but a couple of minutes to ask the modder you are editing files from to check it's not a problem.
 
The rule is about borrowing stuff from a mod. Submods just edits some files, but require the main mod to work.

Although, it does take but a couple of minutes to ask the modder you are editing files from to check it's not a problem.
That is how you interpret the rule, but the wordage says nothing about sub-modding, just that you can't use another modders content without permission. It's very vague and that's why I don't like it.

I think you misunderstood. It doesn't take a couple minutes especially if the mod you are using is a combination and/or submod. How far do you have to go down the rabbit hole?
 
Sorry to interrupt, but i thought a response is better this time , than just another "respectfully disagree".

That is how you interpret the rule,..

I personaly disagree.
Gigau is a long serving modder and only became a mod recently, if only a demi-mod.
If there is a demi-mod that knows how to interprete it, then him and i agree with him too. :rolleyes::p

I also get the impression you don't know the practice of this rule. The rabbit hole is an assumption.
Seems to be for instance no issue for the makers of several CK2 submods for AGOT, HIP, AfterTheEnd or CK2Plus.
I doubt the submods on the Workshop ask for permission for example or that anyone cares.

Especially as submods usualy, so i admittedly presume, don't have to copy material in the first place.

So called 'submods' for Victoria II though fall under that rule, at least as far as i recall, as they are standalone mods
and not dependant on running the original mod. Simple.

It's very vague and that's why I don't like it.

Welcome to law. :D

In the end Paradox can apply the rule as they please. It's their right.
In practice it seems to be working okay.

Just my 2cents. Maybe helpful, maybe not.
Good night.
 
.. Also the rabbit hole is not an assumption. It exists :)...

*dumdumdum*

RABBITS ! HOLES !

Sorry. :oops:
Seriously now, i suggest if you have a specific idea on an issue, to contact a moderator via "Start a Conversation"
and maybe post your conclusion afterwards or so.

I disagree with the wordage
If it's 'only' the wordage, give an example what you'd prefer, but i assume it's kept that way, as they can apply it as required.
Detailed and precise rules often just cause detailed and precise workarounds, cop-outs, excuses, if you know what i mean.
Thus the ambiguity and vagueness. So i'd think.
 
Out of nostalgia, I’ve been tinkering with adapting the old legacy terrain tile-sets that were used in broadly in the previous generation of Paradox games (EU3, Victoria 2, HOI3, etc.) for EU4. They’re over 10 years old at this point, and some of them still linger in the current generation’s files, unused. Am I correct in assuming that these would still be subject rule number 7, and it wouldn’t be possible to easily release a mod including them?
 
Hello guys,

I'm writing this post in regards to understanding some of the conflicting things I've read online regarding your modding policies. I've spent countless hours playing your games and love them to bits. Lately I've picked up modding and spent many more hours trying to figure out how to edit files and create my own interesting scenarios, leading to the creation of a mod for HOI4 that I've posted on the steam workshop.

My question to you would be regarding the legality of creating a Patreon page (either for the mod itself or for me the creator) and adding it to the mod description so people could help support the creation process or me in general. Would such an action go against your terms and conditions?

Hope to hear from you,
Kindest regards,

Nyiix
 
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My question to you would be regarding the legality of creating a Patreon page (either for the mod itself or for me the creator) and adding it to the mod description so people could help support the creation process or me in general. Would such an action go against your terms and conditions?
You are indeed allowed to do this as long as you are not charging for the mod itself. In short, if the mod is free for everyone, regardless of them being Patrons or not, then yes that's fine.
 
You are indeed allowed to do this as long as you are not charging for the mod itself. In short, if the mod is free for everyone, regardless of them being Patrons or not, then yes that's fine.

Thank you for your quick reply. Yes the mod would be free for everyone and all of the content and updates would be for free. The patreon would only be an option for people who would like to support me personally. Just for some clarification, I saw that a lot of great mods out there (Kaiserreich and Modern Day) don't have patreon pages and therefore thought that it might be illegal, but this is great news.

Thank you very much,

Nyiix