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Tinto Talks #50 - 12th February 2025

Hey everyone, and welcome back. Johan is busy today (allegedly) so instead I will walk you through this Tinto Talks on Formable Countries in our little project called Caesar. It’s a fairly tight feature so this should be nice and quick.



What are Formable Countries?

Basically, formable countries are new tags that you can switch to. Typically they represent historical unions and conquests, but some represent aspirations that never materialised.

Generally speaking, the vision behind Formables is to offer roleplaying and historical immersion, and support player fantasies, rather than modifier stacking. They will change your country name, national flag, and map color. So while you may unlock some content such as advances or other minor unique content, the tag change is often the goal in itself.

Screenshot 2025-02-12 113332.png
Screenshot 2025-02-12 112612.png

Spain gets some unique advances in the later ages, but not all do.

Rather than your country changing automatically every age, you achieve it by completing certain objectives. Usually, you'll need to control a certain percentage of a predefined set of locations, for example Scandinavia needs 75% of the locations in the Scandinavia region.

There’s typically additional requirements as well such as your Primary Culture belonging to a certain Culture Group. Forming Spain also requires you and all the independent countries in Iberia to be Christian, as it is thematically closely tied to the completion of the Reconquista. Iberian Muslims have the reverse rules for forming Al-Andalus.

Some are directly tied to actions in International Organizations, like the Holy Roman Empire or the Ilkhanate.

Formables also have a Tier that represents their natural order of precedence. You can only form countries that are the same or higher tier than you. For example, England (Tier 2) can form Great Britain (Tier 3) but Great Britain can’t form England. The AI will only form countries that are a higher tier.


Screenshot 2025-02-12 124554.png

Country formation is just a click away.


There are 3 settings to the relevant game rule.
  1. Only Historical Formable Countries
    1. Only countries that actually formed in the game’s time period will be allowed.
      1. Examples are Spain and Great Britain
  2. Allow Plausible Formable Countries(Default)
    1. Countries that could plausible have formed, or formed just after the time period will be allowed.
      1. Examples are Germany and Italy
  3. Allow Ahistorical Formable Countries
    1. Aspirational or fantasy countries can be formed. Examples include
      1. North Sea Empire (which is a Tier IV) if you control Britain and Scandinavia
      2. Europa (Tier V)



Screenshot 2025-02-12 121247.png

Some countries have different flags depending on the exact manner in which they are formed. For example this variant of the Union Jack with a dominant saltire when you start as Scotland.


1739361227786.png

And some formables come with little treats to sweeten the deal.


Screenshot 2025-02-12 123920.png

The Teutonic Order has a long way to go before they can become Prussia…


Screenshot 2025-02-12 124144.png

But it might be worth it…


Screenshot 2025-02-12 121702.png

Some exist to fulfil common player fantasies, but only appear if the player chooses in the Game Rules to have the less historical ones.



This is our current list of formable countries, let us know which ones you would like us add!

FormableTierNote
Europa5Ahistorical
Rome4Ahistorical
Hindustan4Plausible
Holy Roman Empire4Plausible
Byzantium4
Ilkhanate4
Iran4
Mongolia4
Mughals4
Rûm4
Russia4
United States4
Celtica3Ahistorical
Latin Empire3Ahistorical
North Sea3Ahistorical
Al-Andalus3Plausible
Arabia3Plausible
Canada3Plausible
Egypt3Plausible
Germany3Plausible
Italy3Plausible
Malaya3Plausible
Ruthenia3Plausible
Scandinavia3Plausible
Shan3Plausible
Banten3
Bengal3
Deccan3
Delhi3
Ethiopia3
Great Britain3
Gujurat3
Hausa3
Inca3
Kongo3
Manchu3
Maratha3
Mexico3
Poland-Lithuania3
Punjab3
Rajput3
Siam3
Sokoto3
Spain3
Timurids3
Two Sicilies3
Yamato3
Africa2Ahistorical
Carthage2Ahistorical
Hen Ogledd2Ahistorical
Aotearoa2Plausible
Greece2Plausible
Jerusalem2Plausible
Livonia2Plausible
Maya2Plausible
Albania2
Armenia2
Austria2
Ayutthaya2
Bahamis2
England2
Georgia2
Golden Horde2
Holstein2
Ireland2
Navarre2
Nepal2
Netherlands2
Poland2
Prussia2
Scotland2
Serbia2
Sweden2
Switzerland2
Tibet2
Wales2
Connacht1Plausible
Ulster1Plausible
Aïr1
Bavaria1
Beja1
Mazovia1
Mecklenburg1
Mossi1
Nassau1
Northumbria1
Pomerania1
Sardinia1
Saxony1
Silesia1


That's it for today's dev diary. Thanks for reading, and we'll see you next time, where we will talk about Subject Types, and an interesting part of the Castilian player fantasy…
 
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Proposal for the 1. tier formable countries:

Styria
1739380133590.png

- You are not Austria, Tyrol, Salzburg or a formed country of tier 1 or higher.
- You control 80% of the area of Styria

Carniola
1739380159074.png

- You are not Austria, Tyrol, Salzburg or a formed country of tier 1 or higher.
- You control 80% of the area of Carniola

Carinthia
1739380237473.png

- You are not Austria, Tyrol, Salzburg or a formed country of tier 1 or higher.
- You control 80% of the area of Carinthia

Optionally, they could all have a requirement for primary cultures such as Slovenian, Danube Bavarian and South Bavarian.
 
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I would like to see the following formable countries:

  1. Dacia(I have noticed in other Paradox Games as Carpathia, but it sounds funny but Dacia has a historical argument to be better than Carpathia)
  2. Maybe Moldovan Empire and if Moldova founds Dacia(Empire) to have some specific flag specifics like you made for the Great Britain Flag if Scottland formed it. Let´s say the bison of Moldovan flag to be present somehow on the Dacian flag with the Wolf or keep just the wolf but to be red since Moldova has a red flag.
  3. The case in point 2 should also put in the scenario Wallachia founded it. By the way, originally the name actually is Valahia.
  4. To have the possibility to make Romania. I like also the idea to have both possibilities(Romania and Dacia) which I think is nice.
  5. I am not sure what is the plan regarding the custom nation with color, name and flag but if is possible somehow to make it as in CK3, I would like it but I also love the organic change in the Victoria 3 flags. It would be nice to have both 2 functions.
 
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Off the top of my head, I would say the well-known hypothetical Lotharingia (i.e. Low Countries and some of the Franco-German border zone, for Burgundy for instance) is missing, given the historical aspirations. A Romanian union could also be plausible. Would also suggest a Baltica for the Baltic culture nations, and Kurland for the historical duchy. Maghreb might also make sense. A fun very ahistorical one might be Anglo-Frisia.

I see Mexico on the list. Would it make sense to suggest post-colonial formables? Or should we wait for the Colonial nations DD?
 
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Hey everyone, and welcome back. Johan is busy today (allegedly) so instead I will walk you through this Tinto Talks on Formable Countries in our little project called Caesar. It’s a fairly tight feature so this should be nice and quick.



What are Formable Countries?

Basically, formable countries are new tags that you can switch to. Typically they represent historical unions and conquests, but some represent aspirations that never materialised.

Generally speaking, the vision behind Formables is to offer roleplaying and historical immersion, and support player fantasies, rather than modifier stacking. They will change your country name, national flag, and map color. So while you may unlock some content such as advances or other minor unique content, the tag change is often the goal in itself.

View attachment 1253582View attachment 1253583
Spain gets some unique advances in the later ages, but not all do.

Rather than your country changing automatically every age, you achieve it by completing certain objectives. Usually, you'll need to control a certain percentage of a predefined set of locations, for example Scandinavia needs 75% of the locations in the Scandinavia region.

There’s typically additional requirements as well such as your Primary Culture belonging to a certain Culture Group. Forming Spain also requires you and all the independent countries in Iberia to be Christian, as it is thematically closely tied to the completion of the Reconquista. Iberian Muslims have the reverse rules for forming Al-Andalus.

Some are directly tied to actions in International Organizations, like the Holy Roman Empire or the Ilkhanate.

Formables also have a Tier that represents their natural order of precedence. You can only form countries that are the same or higher tier than you. For example, England (Tier 3) can form Great Britain (Tier 4) but Great Britain can’t form England. The AI will only form countries that are a higher tier.


View attachment 1253586
Country formation is just a click away.


There are 3 settings to the relevant game rule.
  1. Only Historical Formable Countries
    1. Only countries that actually formed in the game’s time period will be allowed.
      1. Examples are Spain and Great Britain
  2. Allow Plausible Formable Countries(Default)
    1. Countries that could plausible have formed, or formed just after the time period will be allowed.
      1. Examples are Germany and Italy
  3. Allow Ahistorical Formable Countries
    1. Aspirational or fantasy countries can be formed. Examples include
      1. North Sea Empire (which is a Tier IV) if you control Britain and Scandinavia
      2. Europa (Tier V)



View attachment 1253589
Some countries have different flags depending on the exact manner in which they are formed. For example this variant of the Union Jack with a dominant saltire when you start as Scotland.


View attachment 1253591
And some formables come with little treats to sweeten the deal.


View attachment 1253592
The Teutonic Order has a long way to go before they can become Prussia…


View attachment 1253593
But it might be worth it…


View attachment 1253594
Some exist to fulfil common player fantasies, but only appear if the player chooses in the Game Rules to have the less historical ones.



This is our current list of formable countries, let us know which ones you would like us add!

FormableTierNote
Europa5Ahistorical
Rome4Ahistorical
Hindustan4Plausible
Holy Roman Empire4Plausible
Byzantium4
Ilkhanate4
Iran4
Mongolia4
Mughals4
Rûm4
Russia4
United States4
Celtica3Ahistorical
Latin Empire3Ahistorical
North Sea3Ahistorical
Al-Andalus3Plausible
Arabia3Plausible
Canada3Plausible
Egypt3Plausible
Germany3Plausible
Italy3Plausible
Malaya3Plausible
Ruthenia3Plausible
Scandinavia3Plausible
Shan3Plausible
Banten3
Bengal3
Deccan3
Delhi3
Ethiopia3
Great Britain3
Gujurat3
Hausa3
Inca3
Kongo3
Manchu3
Maratha3
Mexico3
Poland-Lithuania3
Punjab3
Rajput3
Siam3
Sokoto3
Spain3
Timurids3
Two Sicilies3
Yamato3
Africa2Ahistorical
Carthage2Ahistorical
Hen Ogledd2Ahistorical
Aotearoa2Plausible
Greece2Plausible
Jerusalem2Plausible
Livonia2Plausible
Maya2Plausible
Albania2
Armenia2
Austria2
Ayutthaya2
Bahamis2
England2
Georgia2
Golden Horde2
Holstein2
Ireland2
Navarre2
Nepal2
Netherlands2
Poland2
Prussia2
Scotland2
Serbia2
Sweden2
Switzerland2
Tibet2
Wales2
Connacht1Plausible
Ulster1Plausible
Aïr1
Bavaria1
Beja1
Mazovia1
Mecklenburg1
Mossi1
Nassau1
Northumbria1
Pomerania1
Sardinia1
Saxony1
Silesia1


That's it for today's dev diary. Thanks for reading, and we'll see you next time, where we will talk about Subject Types, and an interesting part of the Castilian player fantasy…

little mistake there .
Hindustan is the name of the Mughal empire as an entity but it also refers in general to any arabo persian islamic domain in india since its the muslims who did call the region India inspiring it from the hindou river just like the greeks before them but not the locals . the locals obviously call it baharat but foreigners dont so Hindustan is an exonyme. Hindustan already exist in the game.
Ain-i-Akbari 16th-century detailed document refered to the Mughals as Hindustan
Bahadur Shah II also called it Hindustan.

other names of Mughal holdings are Saltanat al Hind - Bilad al Hind - Wilayate Hindoustan for ( Hind Sultanat - land of India - Dominion of Hindoustan) respectively.

Mughal itself is not a real name but a kind of slur turned to an exonym that remind the locals and rival nations like persia that the rulers are mongols related to the chagatai khanate .
the real dynasty's name is Gūrkāniyān.
so Mughal empire is not a true name , the correct name is Wilayate Hindoustan as stated in Ain i akbari document.
Mughal come from the perso arabic Maghul that means "mongol"
 
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Latin Empire3Ahistorical
Why is the Latin Empire ahistorical? If the total reunification of the Mongol Empire is under historical I can't see how the natural progression and, at least stated, end goal of a lot of the Frakokratia polities would be ahistorical? Especially when direct line claimants still very much exist and actively rule land in Greece.
 
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let us know which ones you would like us add!
Lotharingia
Latvia
Belarus
Antioch
Israel
Sardinia Piedmont
Denmark Norway(or do the same with my plc union act suggestion)
Mongol empire
and for the funni USSR as pessant republics
Poland-Lithuania
Maybee the PLC's union of Lublin could function as a special integration act in the union parliament? since Lithuania was still a separate state during the plc
 
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How about Aquitaine and Angevin Empire for formable countries?
 
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would be cool to add a "Lusitania" or some variant, in case Portugal ends up owning the iberia peninsula?
The devs already mentioned that Spain can also be formed by Portugal (in, for example, a Portuguese-dominated Iberian Union with Castile), which is historically accurate since at the time of Project Caesar's start date the medieval notion of Spain included all of the Iberian Peninsula, and indeed Portugal could have been considered a "core" part of modern Spain instead of Aragon had the Iberian Union gone a different way.
 
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And what about Belgium, could be tier 2, not sure whether historical, plausible or ahistorical.
 
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Is it possible to add various smaller formables in Italy?I wouldn't want the region to have disproportionally more formables that the others but there are some intresting ones:
Cisalpine Republic
Duchy of Tuscany
Kingdom of Sardinia-Piedmont
Duchy of Spoleto (Plausible)
 
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