Tinto Maps #5 Italy Feedback

[AntarcticRanger]

I know that there are Greek/Griko minorities in Sicily and Southern Italy but have they also been added to Malta? According to Wikipedia, there should be some in 1337. If I have understood it correctly, the majority of them should be Catholic, while a minority should be Eastern Orthodox.

Greeks in Malta - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

My personal understanding of Griko religion is that they were Greek rite Catholics that gradually over the course of the first half of the game became Latin rite Catholics. Eu5 representing them as Orthodox flat out worries me actually, as it looks like a sign that we aren't getting any Greek Catholics in this game.

 

[Atromb]

Hi there! A casual screenshot of a map fix that we've just implemented in the game:

View attachment 1304382

Great! Could you make Venice the faction red now?

After watching some of the early acces videos I have become convinced that it is extremely hard to tell Venice apart from Verona, and venetian vassals appart from napolitan ones (relevant in greece).
And then it dawned on me, why is Venice blue anyhow? Because it was the case in EU4? The venetian flag is crimson red, and I feel that changing Venice to that color would both feel a lot more appropiate and make Venice a lot easier to distinguish from its neighbouring powers.

Would greatly apreciate if the tinto team can take this into consideration @SaintDaveUK !

Most people seemed to agree with me on that suggestion. Its too easy to confuse it with Verona or Naples.

 

[Pickman89]

Hi there! A casual screenshot of a map fix that we've just implemented in the game:

View attachment 1304382

It's nice but it's a shame that it seems a single big island. It would be cool to display that it's several islands (some of them a not close to the Canal Grande).
Would it make sense to also add a connection to the location to the south (where there is Chioggia)? It might not maybe be the easiest way to invade Venice but it was probably easier than going through the area of the current bridge which was built on in the XIX century.

 

[sammyQc]

Hi there! A casual screenshot of a map fix that we've just implemented in the game:

View attachment 1304382

 

[matfer13]

Honestly, the same principle applies to Tenochtitlan, which was built on an island and similarly relied on its water-based geography for defense, trade, and urban planning. The canal system and floating gardens were as integral to its identity as Venice's lagoon was to the Venetian Republic. I wouldn't be surprised if it was also the case for other historically significant island or water-dependent cities elsewhere.

I'm not arguing that Tenochtitlan should necessarily be represented as an island city (though it probably should), just pointing out that while I'm pleased Venice received this special treatment, it's not accurate to consider their geographical situation unique.

I'm not against the idea, but Tenochtitlan is on a lake so it's not like you'll be able to block the strait crossing

 

[Pavía]

LETS FUCKING GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Also, did you do a similar thing for Hormuz and Tenochtitlan?

We can't apply the same treatment to Tenochtitlan or other places for a simple reason: it's a matter of scale. I'm going to use the pixel map, that we use to draw the locations, to show what I'm talking about.

Here is Lake Texcoco, with the island of Tenochtitlan marked in - it's 6 pixels:

This is what happens if I grow it to 100 pixels, the bare minimum threshold that we consider acceptable for a location to be considered playable in the 3D map:

This looks more like modern City of Mexico than Tenochtitlan, as there's no Lake Texcoco anymore, I'd say...

On a personal level, I'd also love to have Tenochtitlan portrayed as an island; but project-wise, this is what we all think will work better for it from both a gameplay and a visual perspective

In Venice, we've been able to make an exception for two reasons: it already had the lagoon around it, allowing us to 'fake' its shape quite decently; and because of it being so important for gameplay reasons, as now it will have the behavior we want for it.

PS: Before anybody asks - we can't share the pixel map with you yet, sorry.

 

[AntarcticRanger]

Before anybody asks - we can't share the pixel map with you yet, sorry

Will we be able to see it before release?

 

[Gurtannon]

We can't apply the same treatment to Tenochtitlan or other places for a simple reason: it's a matter of scale. I'm going to use the pixel map, that we use to draw the locations, to show what I'm talking about.

Here is Lake Texcoco, with the island of Tenochtitlan marked in - it's 6 pixels:
View attachment 1304722

This is what happens if I grow it to 100 pixels, the bare minimum threshold that we consider acceptable for a location to be considered playable in the 3D map:

Benevanto is already below 100 pixel

If you go with same pixel area or slightly less of Benevanto, it can easily fit into that place

View attachment 1304729
This looks more like modern City of Mexico than Tenochtitlan, as there's no Lake Texcoco anymore, I'd say...

On a personal level, I'd also love to have Tenochtitlan portrayed as an island; but project-wise, this is what we all think will work better for it from both a gameplay and a visual perspective

In Venice, we've been able to make an exception for two reasons: it already had the lagoon around it, allowing us to 'fake' its shape quite decently; and because of it being so important for gameplay reasons, as now it will have the behavior we want for it.
.

There is enough pixel for Tenochtitlan
(Lake texture may stay only hitbox is enough as city sizes are reduced a lot too there is no risk of overlapping with sea)

 

[philiko20]

My personal understanding of Griko religion is that they were Greek rite Catholics that gradually over the course of the first half of the game became Latin rite Catholics. Eu5 representing them as Orthodox flat out worries me actually, as it looks like a sign that we aren't getting any Greek Catholics in this game.

Yeah, true. I wonder if they somehow could implement them, would be a nice detail. I am not an expert in the matter, but shouldn't they also "appear" when any of the Catholic Italian nations conquer Eastern Orthodox populated areas and try to convert or assimilate them?

It should also be easier for proper Catholics to convert the Greek Catholics, compared to converting Greek Orthodox while it should be pretty easy for the Orthodox to convert them to proper Orthodoxy.

 

[Sebroar]

We can't apply the same treatment to Tenochtitlan or other places for a simple reason: it's a matter of scale. I'm going to use the pixel map, that we use to draw the locations, to show what I'm talking about.

Here is Lake Texcoco, with the island of Tenochtitlan marked in - it's 6 pixels:
View attachment 1304722

This is what happens if I grow it to 100 pixels, the bare minimum threshold that we consider acceptable for a location to be considered playable in the 3D map:
View attachment 1304729
This looks more like modern City of Mexico than Tenochtitlan, as there's no Lake Texcoco anymore, I'd say...

On a personal level, I'd also love to have Tenochtitlan portrayed as an island; but project-wise, this is what we all think will work better for it from both a gameplay and a visual perspective

In Venice, we've been able to make an exception for two reasons: it already had the lagoon around it, allowing us to 'fake' its shape quite decently; and because of it being so important for gameplay reasons, as now it will have the behavior we want for it.

PS: Before anybody asks - we can't share the pixel map with you yet, sorry.

Would it be possible to only have the hitbox increased? The island might get a slight increase (maybe 2x) just to be more visible, but the hitbox could extend above the lake.

 

[lazprune]

Hi there! A casual screenshot of a map fix that we've just implemented in the game:

View attachment 1304382

So cool! Now please do the same for Tenochtitlan (more pixels than how the city look like?) ^^'

 

[JacceDON]

Why are people asking for Tenochtitlan in the Italy feedback thread? Stick to the Central American one.

 

[Huskermax5]

Can we get an answer to Hormuz?

 

[JacceDON]

Can we get an answer to Hormuz?

In the Italy feedback thread?

 

[Huskermax5]

In the Italy feedback thread?

If the dev is explaining process of “islandification” it makes sense?

 

[JacceDON]

If the dev is explaining process of “islandification” it makes sense?

It doesn't make sense, Pavia just explained it because people were freaking out about Tenochtitlan here instead of in the Central America Map post.

 

[ArVass]

Hi there! A casual screenshot of a map fix that we've just implemented in the game:

View attachment 1304382

Because most of the Venice location is already a lagoon, what about making its topography that of an atoll? Or nah

 

[lucaluca]

why there is cotton in Tuscany and not olives?

Cotton doesn't grow in Italy, it's a subtropical crop, was never cultivated. Olives are everywhere in Tuscany and there isn't a single olive producing location? Tuscany should be mostly olives and wine.

 

[Daniel the Finlander]

Shouldn't Verona now technically own Mestre at game start? Wikipedia says it was handed over by the garrison commander to the Venetians in September 1337 during the Scaliger War in exchange for a bribe. Maybe you could make it an event to railroad it a bit?

(I know it's Wikipedia but it looks well researched with proper references)

I mean apparently the Scaliger war isn’t even represented atm lol, but yeah it should be like this

 

[KolyaKoala]

Hi there! A casual screenshot of a map fix that we've just implemented in the game:

View attachment 1304382

Please, please, please fix Istria as well.