I was thinking along much the same lines, or perhaps an event sequence like the fantasy culture conversion events for Byzantium in AGCEEP, dependant on player choices earlier on. Either way, we really should have some kind of sequence instead of just giving it out.
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really, I still think the Caliphate should interfere greatly in Byzantium, considering they are long arch enemies, and with the Rum gone, the priority to save islam is higher 
well thats my opinion.Oh and I think we should render the name "khaliphate" to Abbasid Caliphate, its more historically correct and accurate.Bob have MSN?were taking way too much space
well thats my opinion.Oh and I think we should render the name "khaliphate" to Abbasid Caliphate, its more historically correct and accurate.Bob have MSN?were taking way too much space I have ICQ and AIM, but I'm at school atm so I don't have it here. I am going to lunch in 6 minutes anyways .
I'm not suggesting non-interference...I'd just like to see the Kaliphate have other possible options for expansion. Byz has a very hard time beating Hungary, and it can only really expand to Turkey. I'd just like to see them have a chance. Anyways, I agree that the Kaliphate should be renamed, the "K" at the beginning annoys me for no readily evident reason.
Also, we should perhaps make it easier for the Kaliphate to get Turkish than for Byz, since the provs are already proper religion for them. Still, we should maybe have the events for this fire pretty late game. It's something to think about I guess.
. I'm not suggesting non-interference...I'd just like to see the Kaliphate have other possible options for expansion. Byz has a very hard time beating Hungary, and it can only really expand to Turkey. I'd just like to see them have a chance. Anyways, I agree that the Kaliphate should be renamed, the "K" at the beginning annoys me for no readily evident reason.
Also, we should perhaps make it easier for the Kaliphate to get Turkish than for Byz, since the provs are already proper religion for them. Still, we should maybe have the events for this fire pretty late game. It's something to think about I guess.
Well let me put it this way, I did some quick notes on it:-
War of the Thogor!
My Caliph, the Turks are being crushed by the infidel Byzantines, we must help them before Islam is queched from the Rum lands!Let us teach them a lesson as an example to Franks and Kaffirs alike!Yihhad!
War of the Inner Thogor!(1520-1550)
My lord, the fortress of Angora has fallen to our armies.We have contacted a mighty Turkish dynasty, the Osmanlis.They have a brilliant leader, by the name of Suleyman, he shows much resilliance and ability, and wishes to capture Costantinople herself for Islam!perhaps we should give him a chance?though I doubt these barbarians could do anything....
Begining of the Ionian war!
With the Caliphate and Byzantium clashing over the Turkish lands, it has become obvious that only one could reign supreme over Turkey.In 1543, a noble by the name of Egustus, ignited the Great war of Ionia by raiding the borders and towns of the Caliphate.Furious by the audacity of the Byzantines, the Caliph demanded recompensation from the Greeks, who refused to even repay the Caliphate for her losses.This ignited the massive Greco-Islamic war of Ionia.Many men perished as wave after wave of Muslim soldiers met wave after wave of defenders under the walls of Costantinople.Several cities were devestated , such as Nicea which was devestated completely.The Turks and muslims were forced to flee parts of inner Turkey as Byzantine mercenaries and cataracts burned and raided towns and villages.The Ionian war eneded when the muslims were halted in the small islands of Ionia, but only after the Byzantines faired great losses.Peace was signed with Byzantium,seceding Bursa to the Caliphate, where Governor Sulyeman Al-Osmanli adminstrated the Caliphates provinces in Turkey.
Second Ionian War
Suleyman grew tense as the Caliphate withdrew to fight other enemies, rather than capture Costantinople for the glory of Islam.He petitioned the Caliph in Baghdad to allow him to invade Al-Gostantiniyah.The Caliph agreed, but Suleyman did not fair well against the powerful Byzantine fortresses and castles built after the first war.This war however, was not a complete loss as Sulyeman mapped the whole of Costantinople, and readied his armies for an invasion that would freak the whole christian world, and send shudders in the cross's followers.
Battle of Costantinople
Suleyman led a massive armyof about 30 thousand Turks,equipped with muskets and canons fresh from Baghdad and laid siege to the Great city of Costantinople.He built a small palace to stand as a block against supplies into the city, not to mention he used a smart method of fairying ships by land on greased boards.After 50 days of siege, he captured the city of Costantinople, and converted the Hagia Sofia into a mosque.He sent the Byzantine Ragilia to the Caliph, who bestowed upon Sulyeman the nickname "Al-Fatih" and "Sayef Al-islam".The Empror and his advisors fleed to the south...
Turkish power questioned
With the Turkish victory against the Byzantines, it became apparent that they grew more bolder against the decisions of the Caliph in Baghdad, it was time to deal with them and eliminate their threat to the thread of the state completely.Some advised the Caliph to kill Suleyman, others encourged the Caliph to take stricter measures, while others were apathetic to the Turkish victory, the choice is yours my lord...
These are just some sketch ideas
War of the Thogor!
My Caliph, the Turks are being crushed by the infidel Byzantines, we must help them before Islam is queched from the Rum lands!Let us teach them a lesson as an example to Franks and Kaffirs alike!Yihhad!
War of the Inner Thogor!(1520-1550)
My lord, the fortress of Angora has fallen to our armies.We have contacted a mighty Turkish dynasty, the Osmanlis.They have a brilliant leader, by the name of Suleyman, he shows much resilliance and ability, and wishes to capture Costantinople herself for Islam!perhaps we should give him a chance?though I doubt these barbarians could do anything....
Begining of the Ionian war!
With the Caliphate and Byzantium clashing over the Turkish lands, it has become obvious that only one could reign supreme over Turkey.In 1543, a noble by the name of Egustus, ignited the Great war of Ionia by raiding the borders and towns of the Caliphate.Furious by the audacity of the Byzantines, the Caliph demanded recompensation from the Greeks, who refused to even repay the Caliphate for her losses.This ignited the massive Greco-Islamic war of Ionia.Many men perished as wave after wave of Muslim soldiers met wave after wave of defenders under the walls of Costantinople.Several cities were devestated , such as Nicea which was devestated completely.The Turks and muslims were forced to flee parts of inner Turkey as Byzantine mercenaries and cataracts burned and raided towns and villages.The Ionian war eneded when the muslims were halted in the small islands of Ionia, but only after the Byzantines faired great losses.Peace was signed with Byzantium,seceding Bursa to the Caliphate, where Governor Sulyeman Al-Osmanli adminstrated the Caliphates provinces in Turkey.
Second Ionian War
Suleyman grew tense as the Caliphate withdrew to fight other enemies, rather than capture Costantinople for the glory of Islam.He petitioned the Caliph in Baghdad to allow him to invade Al-Gostantiniyah.The Caliph agreed, but Suleyman did not fair well against the powerful Byzantine fortresses and castles built after the first war.This war however, was not a complete loss as Sulyeman mapped the whole of Costantinople, and readied his armies for an invasion that would freak the whole christian world, and send shudders in the cross's followers.
Battle of Costantinople
Suleyman led a massive armyof about 30 thousand Turks,equipped with muskets and canons fresh from Baghdad and laid siege to the Great city of Costantinople.He built a small palace to stand as a block against supplies into the city, not to mention he used a smart method of fairying ships by land on greased boards.After 50 days of siege, he captured the city of Costantinople, and converted the Hagia Sofia into a mosque.He sent the Byzantine Ragilia to the Caliph, who bestowed upon Sulyeman the nickname "Al-Fatih" and "Sayef Al-islam".The Empror and his advisors fleed to the south...
Turkish power questioned
With the Turkish victory against the Byzantines, it became apparent that they grew more bolder against the decisions of the Caliph in Baghdad, it was time to deal with them and eliminate their threat to the thread of the state completely.Some advised the Caliph to kill Suleyman, others encourged the Caliph to take stricter measures, while others were apathetic to the Turkish victory, the choice is yours my lord...
These are just some sketch ideas
I'm back . Anyways, I like the ideas but we would have to program ourselves a Byzantine victory event. I'd also likely code in a "cost of war" event for each conflict, taking population away from a few areas. We could also have victory events for each side...hmmm this could get complex. I would, in any case, like to downgrade Suleyman since he perhaps would not be quite so well educated as he was in reality, since a general of his stature would be nigh unstoppable early in the game. Other than that, it looks pretty darn good. However, this would require quite a bit of coordination with the Byzantine crew, I'll have to look into it. I guess I'll create a new thread to discuss Byzantine-Kaliphate relations. I'll go post it there now. My only concern is that we might interfere with other Byzantine event sequences, I can't remember the timing at all as I don't have the file handy and I haven't played Byzantium in ages.
P.S. We could make the cost of war events more interesting by giving both sides "rebuild" options much like with the arsenal of Freiburg event, but with the options being don't do anything, with pop loss and loss of BTV, repair infrastructure, keeping BTV but substantial pop loss, build at back as it was before, minor pop loss, small boost to infra tech, no BTV loss, or build it grander than it has ever been, BTV increase, minor pop loss.
. Anyways, I like the ideas but we would have to program ourselves a Byzantine victory event. I'd also likely code in a "cost of war" event for each conflict, taking population away from a few areas. We could also have victory events for each side...hmmm this could get complex. I would, in any case, like to downgrade Suleyman since he perhaps would not be quite so well educated as he was in reality, since a general of his stature would be nigh unstoppable early in the game. Other than that, it looks pretty darn good. However, this would require quite a bit of coordination with the Byzantine crew, I'll have to look into it. I guess I'll create a new thread to discuss Byzantine-Kaliphate relations. I'll go post it there now. My only concern is that we might interfere with other Byzantine event sequences, I can't remember the timing at all as I don't have the file handy and I haven't played Byzantium in ages.P.S. We could make the cost of war events more interesting by giving both sides "rebuild" options much like with the arsenal of Freiburg event, but with the options being don't do anything, with pop loss and loss of BTV, repair infrastructure, keeping BTV but substantial pop loss, build at back as it was before, minor pop loss, small boost to infra tech, no BTV loss, or build it grander than it has ever been, BTV increase, minor pop loss.
Honestly I think you have a better creative thinking process than me, so I will probably try to run ideas by you before I do anything . Besides, you know the history of the area by far better than I .
P.S. I think I've picked up 20 posts just today lol....I'm going to have carpal tunnel syndrome now .
. Besides, you know the history of the area by far better than I .P.S. I think I've picked up 20 posts just today lol....I'm going to have carpal tunnel syndrome now
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the Tuko-Byz events will be hard, but Im thinking of events about Costantinople AFTER islam gets it.There will be resistance, but what if Islam keeps it?wont the Hungarians do anything?wont this help the Arab Reniassance as the riches of Costantinople are hailed to Baghdad? it opens alot of possibilities, or perhaps an empror converts to islam and breaks the Byzantine Empire in two?an Islamic one and an orthadox one?Im also waiting for this Hindustan idea, sounds intresting Im only trying to make this look like a nation, I was actually disappointed seeing the scarsity of events for the Caliphate
Im only trying to make this look like a nation, I was actually disappointed seeing the scarsity of events for the Caliphate Ooh idea. We could perhaps give the Caliphate the option of being a semi naval nation if a few things happen. Note that this would require a fairly complex event sequence, but it would sure be interesting.
First, we will probably have at least one army reform event...I can put in a "Let us turn to the sea instead" option. Later, the Caliphate will have a conflict with the Fatamids/Egypt...if they win their war and annex a Red Sea port (for our purposes the Arabian Peninsula ones won't count), then they will get another event about the East African coast. They should get a chance from this to go colonial and move into East Africa, with maybe a later on shipyard and interaction with Ethiopia. Anyways this is a fairly whimsical event and would actually produce an Indian Ocean power, not a Meditteranean one most likely. I don't know mod policy on ai files, and I don't know how to code them, but we could try and institute a colonizing AI file and wake a few explorers and conquistadors.
First, we will probably have at least one army reform event...I can put in a "Let us turn to the sea instead" option. Later, the Caliphate will have a conflict with the Fatamids/Egypt...if they win their war and annex a Red Sea port (for our purposes the Arabian Peninsula ones won't count), then they will get another event about the East African coast. They should get a chance from this to go colonial and move into East Africa, with maybe a later on shipyard and interaction with Ethiopia. Anyways this is a fairly whimsical event and would actually produce an Indian Ocean power, not a Meditteranean one most likely. I don't know mod policy on ai files, and I don't know how to code them, but we could try and institute a colonizing AI file and wake a few explorers and conquistadors.
Hmm...I dunno about a split, I don't think that there will be enough Byzantine land left lol....but the Italian states and Hungary could squabble over the remains in Greece...and there could perhaps be a crusade to attempt to reclaim constantinople. If the Crusade fails, then we could convert constantinople to sunni and give the Caliphate a booster, as this would probably be quite the accomplishment. We'll see, this will require a great deal of coordination with the other national coding people...
I like it!we can add that before the Egyptian events, no?it would make more sense.They gain cores in Egypt, so that would make the Caliphate....
Persia+Arabia+Egypt+part of Nubia+ Turkey I agree 100%
Persia+Arabia+Egypt+part of Nubia+ Turkey
I agree 100%Hehe if they did that though then their land armies would suffer and I'd probably sleep some of the conquest events in other areas, since they would be busy with colonialism. For example, the events with the Kaliphate aquiring Persia wouldn't be as strong, probably just conversions instead of gaining the culture, and removing some of the cooler late game events we might put in. It will have to be a definite trade off.
The Caliphate is intresting really, I also have another idea, conflict with grenada.You see historically, the Ummayeds were the arch enemies of the Abbasids.Perhaps an event for Grenada "Claim the title of the Caliph" with the Caliphate retaliating.It could be like a diplomatic war, what do u think?
Interesting...especially if the Fatamids/Mameluks are gone, they could actually have a land war over north Africa. I'll think on it.
errrr nothing to see here, move along .Were just spicing it up, is that a crime?
psssst BoB how about some India conquest events to go into the equation
.Were just spicing it up, is that a crime?psssst BoB how about some India conquest events to go into the equation
Eh, calm down on the strenghtenning of Caliphate, you two.
About innovative, I don't think you should add any effect in the flavor events. They already get innovative changes in most of their events, it's already easy enough to maximize one way or another.
About innovative, I don't think you should add any effect in the flavor events. They already get innovative changes in most of their events, it's already easy enough to maximize one way or another.
The idea really wasn't to strengthen...it was to provide a second possible route to expansion. Going sea would mean focusing on the Indian Ocean and North Africa instead of going into Turkey and concentrating on Persia. Any conquests in those areas would be met with the usual malus, but without most of the benefits. For example, no Persian culture and probably no Turkish culture (but hey, you can have nubian!! WOOHOO!). It wouldn't strengthen the Caliphate...it would simply make it an Indian Ocean middle-range power through an extremely unlikely event sequence that would cost it it's expansion in Anatolia and Persia. Honestly, it might even be an inferior choice given the low techgroup the Caliphate suffers from, meaning that it can't keep up in trade tech which means that even if it goes naval/plutocrat it will have a hard time making huge piles of money...all the while with less manpower and more expensive troops to hold off the armies of its technologically superior foes.
P.S. Lawkeeper I was meaning DP clicks in general, but I suppose that those aren't going to be a good idea either...hmmm. I do ask for permission to code in the potential naval route though, although honestly it will probably be a long time before I actually get down to doing that since I want to settle Persia and Anatolia first.
P.S. Lawkeeper I was meaning DP clicks in general, but I suppose that those aren't going to be a good idea either...hmmm. I do ask for permission to code in the potential naval route though, although honestly it will probably be a long time before I actually get down to doing that since I want to settle Persia and Anatolia first.
Yes, when needed or logical (i.e., when changes are made on a large scale), the use of DP-clicks if fully valid. In the case of going to sea, it's even mandatory given the LAND 10 that the Caliphate starts with.
As a side note, I think it's better if changes aren't massive in one event, but rather sparsed on several events. The more gradual, the better, IMHO.
What I hope you'll completely avoid is the kind of events China receives in vanilla, with several dozens of DP-clicks in one event.
As a second side note, giving different focus to Caliphate should come hand-in-hand with AI-files changes, and not only relations and cores.
As a side note, I think it's better if changes aren't massive in one event, but rather sparsed on several events. The more gradual, the better, IMHO.
What I hope you'll completely avoid is the kind of events China receives in vanilla, with several dozens of DP-clicks in one event.
As a second side note, giving different focus to Caliphate should come hand-in-hand with AI-files changes, and not only relations and cores.