• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
Finally finished the Mp distribution to the provinces. Hopefully I typed/spelled everything right, but if not it should be close enough. Well here you go Elisson without further adiou:

(If it is not on the list then the MP value for the province is 0.)

*For the US and Britain, until they go to war maybe all territories listed should only have manpower of 1 instead of what is given. Then have an event that increases the provinces MP to the given values.

Afghanistan (32)
Kabul – 8
Kandahar – 7
Mazar-i-Sharif – 6
Heart – 7
Chaghcharon – 4

Albania (7)
Tirana – 5
Vlore – 2

Argentina (39)
Buenos Aires – 16
Corrientes – 1
Sante Fe – 2
Cordoba – 6
San Miguel De Tucuman – 2
Mar del Plata – 4
Bahia Blanca – 4
Trelew – 1
Commodoro Rivadavia – 2
San Julian – 1

Austro-Hungry (260)
Graz – 4
Wien – 15
Cieszyn – 3
Premysl – 4
Lwow – 4
Munkas – 3
Kosice – 4
Lucenec – 5
Bratislavia – 10
Ruzomberok – 5
Troppau – 5
Slavkov -5
Neuhaus – 6
Reichenberg – 5
Rijeka – 8
Bregenz – 4
Linz – 5
Praha – 15
Karlsbad – 5
Plzen – 8
Winterberg – 5
Timisoara – 6
Sibiv – 3
Brasov – 2
Piatra Neamt – 5
Cluj-Napoca – 5
Onadea – 5
Arad – 4
Debrecen – 5
Ljubljana – 5
Innsbruck – 3
Horn – 3
Budapest – 15
Szeged – 5
Novi Sad -4
Veszprem – 3
Pecs -4
Szombathely – 5
Dubrovnik -5
Mostar +5
Sarajevo – 6
Osijek – 4
Zagreb – 10
Banja Luka – 5
Split – 6
Bolzano – 5
Salzburg – 5
Klagenfurt – 4

Belgium (38)
Antwerpen – 20
Bruxelles - 22
Arlon – 6

Belgian Congo (5)
Banana – 1
Stanleyville – 1
Elisabethville – 1
Albertville – 1
Buta – 1

Bhutan (1)
Punaka – 1

Bolivia (15)
La Paz – 4
Ribernalto – 2
Trinidad – 2
San Ijnacia – 2
Cohambamke – 2
Santa Cruz – 3

Brazil (121)
Pero Alegre – 3
Curitiba – 3
Campo-Grande – 3
Sao Paulo – 2
Santos – 7
Rio de Janeiro – 27
Vitoria – 4
Belo Horizonte – 7
Salvador – 7
Recife – 9
Fortaleza – 7
Belem – 7
Cuiaba – 3
Maraba – 7
Manajo – 9
Santerem – 7
Boa Vista – 8
Porto Velho – 2
Manus – 2
Tefe – 2
Aruaja – 2
Rio Branco – 2

*British Empire

UK & Ireland (227)
Belfast – 8
Galway – 2
Limerack – 4
Cork – 5
Dublin – 9
Scapa Flow – 1
Inverness – 2
Aberdeen – 3
Perth – 3
Glasgow – 10
Edinburgh – 8
NewCastle – 10
Cardiff – 6
Bristol – 13
Coventry – 15
London – 35
Manchester – 18
Sheffield – 17
Birmingham – 22
Plymoth – 12
Southhampton – 12
Portsmouth – 12

Americas (1)
Bahamas – 1

West Africa (1)
Lagos – 1

East Africa (5)
Nairobi – 2
Mombasa – 2
Ganissa – 1

India & Ceylon (69)
Colomba – 5
Dacca – 1
Calcutta – 9
Gorakhpur – 1
Patna – 4
Cuttack – 1
Lucknow - 1
Vishakhapatnam – 1
Bikanev – 1
Sukka – 1
Jabalpur – 1
Cawnpore – 1
Saharanpur – 1
Delhi – 6
Burhanpur - 1
Nagpur - 1
Bombay – 6
Poona – 1
Jodhpur – 1
Karachi – 4
Hyderbad – 1
Bangalore – 1
Mangalore – 1
Madras – 2
Calicut – 2
Bhopal – 1
Ahmadabad – 1
Rajkot – 1
Jaipur – 1
Hyderabad – 6

Burma & South East Asia (9)
Rangoon – 2
Akayb – 1
Taung-gye – 1
Singapore – 2
Kuala Lampur – 2
Hong Kong – 1

Canada (27)
Gaspe – 2
Quebec – 2
Montreal – 2
Ottawa – 4
Toronto – 5
Sudbury – 1
Winnepeg – 2
Regina – 1
Calgary – 2
Prince Rupert – 2
Victoria (CAN) – 2
Vancouver – 2

South Africa (30)
Vanrhynsdorp – 1
Beauford West – 1
Upington – 1
Cape Town – 6
Port Elizabeth – 3
East London – 3
Durban – 4
Bloemfontein – 3
Jonhannesburg – 7
Salisbury – 1

New Zealand (5)
Christ Church – 2
Wellington – 1
Auckland – 1
Hamilton – 1

Australia (19)
Perth – 2
Darwin – 1
Port Augusta – 2
Melbourne – 3
Canberra – 3
Sydney – 3
Brisbane – 3
Cairns – 1
Wagga Wagga – 1


Bulgaria (24)
Sofia – 10
Thessalonika – 2
Plovdiv – 3
Ruse – 2
Varna – 7

Chile (17)
Antofagasta – 4
Santiago – 7
Concepcion – 2
Puerto Nontt – 2
Punta Arenos – 2

China (2037)
Tane - 10
Hailar - 10
Orogen Zizhiqi – 25
Nenjing – 25
Hegong – 25
Jiamusi – 10
Jixi – 10
Harbin – 25
Beijing – 60
Tonghua – 25
Mukden – 30
Changchun – 25
Qiqnar – 25
Linxi – 25
Hohhot – 25
Fuxin – 25
Jinzhou – 25
Zhangjiakhou – 25
Datong – 25
Tianjin – 25
Taiyuan – 25
Shijiazhuang – 25
Handan -25
Xinxiang – 30
Baotou - 10
Yinchuan – 25
Yanun – 25
Lanzhou – 25
Xiangang – 25
Wuou – 25
Wutunghliao – 25
Chenjdu – 25
Xi’ An – 25
Luoyang – 25
Xiangtan -10
Wuhan – 25
Zhengzhou – 10
Jinan – 50
Xuzhou – 25
Huainan – 32
Lionyungang – 25
Nantung – 40
Nanjing – 25
Hangzhou – 25
Ningbo -40
Wenzhou – 25
Fuzhou – 25
Xiamen – 25
Shantou – 25
Kowloon – 40
Guangzhou – 50
Shaoguan – 25
Huangshi – 25
Changsha – 25
Hengyang – 25
Guilin – 25
Livzhou – 25
Zunyi – 25
Guiyang – 25
Haikou – 10
Bobai – 25
Jiangmen – 25
Nanning -25
Kaiyuan – 10
Mojiang – 10
Kunming – 40
Baoshan – 10
Litang – 25
Baxoi – 25
Chindu – 25
Nagqu -10
Patkaglik – 10
Golmud – 10
Xinming – 25
Zhangye – 25
Anxi – 25
Hami – 10
Urumqi – 25
Kuga – 10
Hotan – 10
Mazar – 10
Jarkant – 10
Kashi – 10
Aksu – 10
Kuldja – 10

Columbia (27)
La Sabana – 2
Campo Corral – 2
Matarca – 2
Bogata – 5
Cartegena – 7
Medellin – 5
Cali – 4

Costa Rica (2)
San Jose – 2

Cuba (12)
La Habana – 7
Camaguey – 5

Denmark (15)
Rekjavik – 1
Kolding – 1
Aarhus – 4
Odense – 1
Kobenhavn – 8

Dominican Republic (5)
Santo Domingo – 5

Ecuador (7)
Guayaquil – 1
Quito – 3
Iquitos – 3

El Salvador (6)
San Salvador – 6

Ethiopia (40)
Addis Abeba – 10
Harar – 5
Dagabur – 5
Magalo – 5
Simma – 5
Gondar – 5
Makale – 5

Finland (16)
Oulu – 1
Vausa – 1
Seinajoki – 1
Pori – 1
Tampere – 1
Turku – 4
Helsinki – 5
Kuopio – 1
Viipuri – 1

Republic of France
Home Territories (198)
Bastia – 3
Toulon – 3
Grenoble – 5
Lyon – 3
Marseilles – 20
Besacon – 3
Dijon – 3
Nancy – 3
Troyes – 3
Metz – 3
Chaumont – 3
Reims – 3
Sedan – 3
Amiens – 3
Lille – 3
Rouen – 3
Auxerre – 3
Paris – 30
Orleans – 3
Le Mans – 3
Caen – 3
Cherbourg – 3
Saint-Malo – 3
D’ Ouseeant – 3
Lorient – 3
Nantes – 3
Bourges – 3
Vichy – 10
Saint Etienne – 3
Chateauroux – 3
Potiers – 3
Cholet – 3
La Rochelle – 3
Limoges – 3
Clermont-Ferrand – 3
Rodez – 3
Nimes – 3
Montpellier – 3
Toulouse – 3
Perigueux – 3
Bordeaux – 10
Bayonne – 3
Auch – 3
Tarbes – 3

North Africa (7)
Oran – 2
Algiers – 3
Tunisia – 2

Sahara (1)
Timbouctou – 1

Madagascar (3)
Tananarive – 2
Fianarantsoa – 1

West Africa (10)
Dakar – 2
Casablanca – 2
Agadir – 2
Fez – 2
Tlemecen – 2

Amercias (1)
Cayenne – 1

Indochina (19)
Saigon – 5
Phnom Penh – 2
Da Nang – 2
Hanoi – 6
Haiphong – 2
Zhanjiang – 2

German Empire
Home Territories (325)
Memel – 7
Konigsberg – 7
Elbing – 5
Danzig – 10
Bydgoszcz – 5
Poznan – 5
Stettin -7
Landsberg – 7
Oppeln – 7
Dresden – 7
Berlin – 40
Rostock – 7
Lubeck – 10
Kiel – 7
Hamburg – 15
Wilhemshafen – 7
Munster – 7
Hannover – 7
Magdeburg – 7
Halle – 7
Leipzig – 7
Erfurt – 7
Frankfurt am Main – 10
Essen – 15
Koln – 15
Saarbruken – 7
Colmar – 7
Freiburg – 7
Stuttgart – 7
Mannheim – 7
Wurzberg – 7
Nurnberg – 7
Muchen – 15
Konstanz – 7

German China (1)
Qingdao – 1

German Africa (13)
Windhoek – 1
Grootfontein – 1
Douala – 1
Lome – 1
Tabora – 2
Lindi – 2
Dar es Saleem – 4
Luderitz – 1

Guatemala (10)
Guatemala City – 10

Honduras (3)
Tegucigalpa – 3

Greece (24)
Athinai – 15
Patrai – 2
Agrinion – 2
Larisa – 2
Ioannina – 2
Iraklion – 2

Haiti (9)
Port-au-Prince – 9

Hedjaz (2)
Mecca – 1
Medina – 1

Italy (186)
Cagliari – 3
Torino – 10
Genoa – 10
Milano – 15
Venezia – 15
Parma – 10
La Spenzia – 8
Messina – 5
Bologna – 10
Firenze – 10
Ancona – 8
Roma – 30
Bari – 4
Napoli – 20
Potenza – 4
Taranto – 15
Cosenza – 4
Siracusa – 5

Japanese Empire (248)
Tomari – 1
Ashahikawa – 3
Sappara – 8
Akita – 10
Sondai – 10
Fukushima – 10
Niigata – 10
Tokyo – 35
Nagoya – 20
Kanazawa – 15
Osaka – 30
Hiroshima – 15
Kochi – 10
Fukuoka – 10
Kagoshima – 15
Naha – 1
Saishu – 1
Koshu – 1
Fuzan – 3
Taihoku – 1
Taikyu – 1
Shunsen – 1
Keijo – 10
Genzen – 1
Heijo – 1
Kanko – 1
Sei Shin – 1
Kange – 1
Sinuiju – 20
Dalian – 3
Takao – 1

Jabal Shammar (1)
Buraydan – 1

Liberia (8)
Monrovia – 8

Luxemburg (1)
Luxemburg – 1

Mexico (74)
Merida – 4
Villahermosa – 3
Acapulco – 5
Vercacruz – 10
Ciudad de Mexico – 20
Guadalajara – 3
San Luis Potosi – 3
Monterrey – 10
Chihuahua – 5
Culiacan – 5
Hermosillo – 5
Tijuana – 3

Mongolia (9)
Moron – 1
Hangay – 1
Houp – 1
Bayandalay – 1
Manlay - 1
Choybalsan – 1
Ulan Bator – 3

Montenegro (1)
Podgorica – 1

Nepal (25)
Katmandu - 25

Nejd (7)
Riyadh – 4
Az Zahran – 3

Netherlands
Home Territories (31)
Amsterdam – 12
Eindhoven – 6
Arnhem – 7
Groningen – 6

Dutch East Indies (11)
Palembang – 1
Batavia – 1
Surabaya – 1
Balikapapan – 1
Makassar – 1
Sorong – 1
Hollandia – 1
Banjuwangi – 1
Medan – 1

Norway (12)
Oslo – 3
Kristiansand – 1
Stavanger – 1
Bergen – 2
Hamar – 1
Trondheim – 2
Narvik – 1
Alesund – 1

Oman (5)
Muscat – 5

Ottoman Empire (164)
Istanbul – 30
Bursa – 10
Izmir – 10
Antalya – 10
Ekisebin -2
Zonguldak – 2
Ankara – 10
Konya – 10
Mersin – 3
Gaziantep – 3
Kayseri – 3
Sivas – 5
Sansun – 3
Trabzon – 3
Kars – 3
Erzurum – 3
Malatya – 3
Diyarbikir – 3
Van – 3
Aleppo – 4
Beirut – 2
Jerusalem – 2
Amman – 2
Damascus – 5
Homs – 3
Rawan – 2
Mosul – 2
Kirkuk – 2
Baghdad – 10
An Nasririyah - 2
Basrah – 8

Panama (2)
Panama City – 2

Paraguay (3)
Asuncion – 2
Mariscal Estigarribia – 1

Persia (50)
Bandar Abbas – 2
Kerman – 2
Birjand – 2
Mashhad – 2
Vandaq – 2
Yazd – 2
Shiraz – 4
Abadan – 2
Esafahan – 4
Qahremanshar – 2
Hamadan – 2
Tabriz – 10
Rasht – 2
Gorgan – 2
Tehrean – 10

Peru (22)
Arequiba – 3
Cuzco – 5
Pucallpa – 3
Lima – 8
Trujillo – 3

Portugal (30)
Azores – 1
Macao – 1
Luanda – 1
Lissabon – 10
Porto – 5
Portalegre – 4
Evora – 4
Faro – 4

Romania (38)
Bucuresti – 15
Ploiesti – 5
Constanta – 5
Dobrich – 5
Iasi – 4
Craiova – 4

Russian Empire (830) [Does not include Polish provinces]
(Siberia and East of the Urals)
Zjamansor – 5
Aktjubinsk – 5
Ufa – 5
Molotov – 5
Serov – 5
Sverdlousk – 5
Tjeljabinsk – 5
Magnitogorosk – 5
Samarakand – 5
Tasjkent – 5
Frunze – 5
Alma-ata – 5
Semipalatinsk – 5
Koktjetav – 5
Kustanaj – 5
Omsk – 5
Tomsk – 5
Novisibirsk – 5
Kyzyl – 5
Bratsk – 5
Irkutsk – 5
Ulan-Ude – 5
Vladivostok – 5
(West of the Urals)
Baku – 5
Krovabad – 5
Jerevan – 5
Groznyj – 5
Tblisi – 5
Batumi – 5
Majkop – 5
Stravropol – 5
Protetarsk – 5
Krasnodar – 5
Stalingrad – 25
Volzjskij – 5
Bostandyk – 5
Astrakhan – 5
Guryev – 5
Vralsk – 5
Saratov – 5
Balasjov – 5
Voronezh – 5
Lipestsk – 5
Ryazan – 5
Tambov – 5
Saransk – 5
Stalinsk – 5
Ulyanousk – 5
Sevastapol – 10
Stalino – 5
Donetsk – 5
Rostov – 20
Morozousk – 5
Millerovo – 5
Stary Oskol – 5
Kharkov – 5
Kiev – 40
Chernigov – 10
Kursk – 5
Bryansk – 10
Gomel – 5
Smolensk – 30
Kaluga – 5
Tula – 10
Moskva – 50
Kalinin – 10
Rybinsk – 5
Vladimir – 10
Nizjnij Novgorod – 5
Archangelsk – 5
Kazan – 10
Vologda – 10
Belomorsk – 5
Murmansk – 10
Petrozavodsk – 5
Tichvin – 5
Bezjetsk – 5
Borovotji – 5
Leningrad – 40
Novgorod – 5
Velikije Luki – 5
Pskov – 5
Resekne – 5
Tallinn – 10
Riga – 20
Liepaja – 5
Daugaupils – 5
Siavliai – 5
Kaunas – 5
Wilno – 5
Vitebsk – 5
Minsk – 30
Mogiljou – 5
Bobrujsk – 5
Mozyr – 5
Zjitomir – 5
Kirovograd – 5
Vinnytsa – 5
Kirovograd – 5
Dnepropetrovsk – 5
Odessa – 30
Kotovsk – 5
Beltsy – 5
Chisinau – 5

Russian Poland (64)
Grodno – 3
Bialystok – 3
Pinsk – 3
Rowne – 3
Brzesc – 3
Nad Bugiem – 3
Lodz – 3
Ostroleka – 3
Sandomierz – 3
Lublin – 3
Suwalki – 3
Warszawa – 10
Torun – 3
Radom – 3
Krakow – 9
Czestochowa – 3

Spain (100)
Las Palmas – 1
Palma de Mallorca – 1
Malaga – 7
Sevilla – 7
Almeria – 1
Granada – 4
Albacete – 1
Cartagena – 6
Valencia – 8
Cuenca – 1
Budajoz – 1
Tarragona – 1
Salamanca – 1
Madrid – 15
Valladolia – 1
Zaragoza – 3
Lleida – 1
Barcelona – 15
Huesca – 1
Pamplona – 2
Bilbao – 5
Burgos – 7
Gijon – 1
Vigo – 2

Sanusia (1)
Al Khufrah - 1

Switzerland (19)
Geneva – 4
Lausanne – 2
Zurish – 8
Bern – 5

Sweden (28)
Malmo – 2
Karlskrona – 1
Kalmar – 2
Norrkiping – 2
Goteborg – 2
Karlstab – 1
Orebro – 1
Stockholm – 6
Gaule – 2
Falun – 1
Ostersund – 1
Sundvall – 2
Umea – 1
Gallivare – 1
Kiruna – 1
Lulea – 1

Tibet (10)
Llhasa – 10
Nang Xian – 1
Samsang – 1
Shiqvanne – 1
Togatax – 1
Gomo – 1

*United States of America
Home Territories (460)
Concord – 5
Buffalo – 15
Boston – 20
New York – 25
Pittsburgh – 25
Washington D.C. – 10
Philadelphia – 20
Charleston – 5
Norfolk – 15
Charlotte – 5
Columbia – 5
Atlanta – 10
Miami – 5
Mobile – 5
Jackson – 5
Nashville – 10
Cleveland – 15
Indianapolis – 5
Detroit – 15
Marquette – 5
Chicago - 20
Minneapolis – 15
Des Moines – 5
St. Louis – 10
Springfield – 5
Little Rock – 5
Shreveport – 5
New Orleans – 15
Houston – 10
San Antonio – 10
Dallas – 10
Tulsa – 5
Kansas City – 5
Omaha – 5
Rapid City – 5
Bismarck - 5
Great Falls – 5
Cheyenne – 5
Denver – 5
Albuquerque – 5
Phoenix – 5
Salt Lake City – 5
Idaho Falls – 5
San Bernadino – 5
Los Angeles – 10
Sacramento – 5
San Francisco – 10
Portland – 5
Bures – 5
Spokane – 5
Seattle – 5

Philippines (8)
Manilla – 6
Davao – 2

Other Territories (18)
Honolulu – 5
Atka – 3
Colon – 2
San Juan - 8

Uruguay (7)
Montevideo – 7

Yemen (4)
Sana – 4

Venezuela (13)
Esmerelda – 2
Ciudad Guyana – 1
Cumana – 1
Maracaibo – 3
Caracas - 4
 
Last edited:
Originally posted by Johan Elisson
Very, very good work shdwknightx (change that goddamn nickname, please :D ;) )! I'll implement it right away!

/Johan

Thanks. Well what do you propose I change it to and why? I have used this nickname for several forums.
 
Are the manpower figures based solely on population or do they include the adjustment for partially-industrialised and third world countries we discussed earler?

I ask because China has a manpower of 2037, (so, presumably, about 8,000 total duing the whole war) but their usable army in WW1 was three divisions (manpower 60)!

Unless we can limit countries like China some other way? - for example severely limiting their ICs, or somehow tweaking their AI to not build troops, or playing with their tech level.

Plus how about this in the china.inc file, as a start?

allowed = {
infantry = no
militia = yes
 
I think it appropriate to insert this constructive criticism of the MP values here.

With the 1.04 patch having reduced MP values for all infantry units in half, so that now one inf. division = 10 MP, the numbers as they are now are somewhat absurd. For example, taking Germany, which has been given a total monthly MP of 33.9, a starting MP of 6481.2, and a mobilization bonus of 7294.7, assuming a game start on 1 Jan. 1914, and war (and mobilization) no later than 1 Sept. 1914, that's a total MP amount of 8*33.9+6481.2+7294.7=14047.1 MP = enough for over 1,400 regular inf. divisions! Even if you keep the MP values as they were under 1.03b (20 MP per inf. division), that's still about 700 divisions' worth of manpower, with monthly increases enough for over a division and a half!

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems highly unrealistic for Germany (or any other major power) to get MP sufficient to produce 400+ divisions at one fell swoop.

The example becomes even more absurd when you look at China. Just looking at the monthly MP, the Chinese get enough monthly MP to produce, even using the higher values of 1.03b, 10 full infantry divisions per month, not even counting the starting MP value or the bonus upon full mobilization!

How, exactly, will this system of MP distribution mesh with MP values for divisions to create a workable, effective system?

IMHO, I liked the first set of values, where German monthly MP was only around 3, because this could easily be offset by higher starting MP values, allowing unit production with the concern of running out of MP still a likely possibility.
 
Originally posted by StephenT
Are the manpower figures based solely on population or do they include the adjustment for partially-industrialised and third world countries we discussed earler?

I ask because China has a manpower of 2037, (so, presumably, about 8,000 total duing the whole war) but their usable army in WW1 was three divisions (manpower 60)!

Unless we can limit countries like China some other way? - for example severely limiting their ICs, or somehow tweaking their AI to not build troops, or playing with their tech level.

Plus how about this in the china.inc file, as a start?

allowed = {
infantry = no
militia = yes

They include the adjustment for partially-industrialized and third world countries. (Even includes the breakdown for pulling MP from colonies and dominion territories.)

China would and should have a large manpower base, but should not have the IC capability to take advantage of it. Their AI should also be tweaked so as to build few men unless at war. Yeah I think China should only be builing militia...however we could give them a few infantry divisions to start off with to represent the foreign trained ones (or give them in events)
 
Originally posted by Thufir Hawat
I think it appropriate to insert this constructive criticism of the MP values here.

With the 1.04 patch having reduced MP values for all infantry units in half, so that now one inf. division = 10 MP, the numbers as they are now are somewhat absurd. For example, taking Germany, which has been given a total monthly MP of 33.9, a starting MP of 6481.2, and a mobilization bonus of 7294.7, assuming a game start on 1 Jan. 1914, and war (and mobilization) no later than 1 Sept. 1914, that's a total MP amount of 8*33.9+6481.2+7294.7=14047.1 MP = enough for over 1,400 regular inf. divisions! Even if you keep the MP values as they were under 1.03b (20 MP per inf. division), that's still about 700 divisions' worth of manpower, with monthly increases enough for over a division and a half!

Well since Germany recruited towards the total war effort over 13 million in real life a possible of 14 million is not too bad. And since not all MP will be used for infantry divisions (and by going by the pre-alpha build I have, most MP is used to preplenish losses from combat). Also the starting MP will be low. When war breaks out the powers will be given an option to call for first round volunteers, the second round, first round draft, second round draft, etc. (at least that is the way I see it being done). If you continue upon the draft a IC/dissent hit will kick in which should cripple number of IC's you have.


Originally posted by Thufir Hawat

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems highly unrealistic for Germany (or any other major power) to get MP sufficient to produce 400+ divisions at one fell swoop.

The example becomes even more absurd when you look at China. Just looking at the monthly MP, the Chinese get enough monthly MP to produce, even using the higher values of 1.03b, 10 full infantry divisions per month, not even counting the starting MP value or the bonus upon full mobilization!

Well China should have a low IC count and should not be able to capitalize on their vast MP (but this should not mean they should not get it), also as StephenT suggested China should not really be producing divisions (unless at war).

Originally posted by Thufir Hawat

How, exactly, will this system of MP distribution mesh with MP values for divisions to create a workable, effective system?

IMHO, I liked the first set of values, where German monthly MP was only around 3, because this could easily be offset by higher starting MP values, allowing unit production with the concern of running out of MP still a likely possibility.

3 monthly MP is way too low. That would represent only 3000 men a month! I think Germany had a bit higher population willing to join the military than that.

Some things to keep in mind:

! MP from a province = 0.1 monthly MP
1 MP = 1000 men
1 vanilla divison = 10 MP (last I checked Elisson has not changed this)

Also I believe there will be some doctrines that will represent some countries having larger divisions thus costing them more MP to recruit a vanilla divison.
 
And since not all MP will be used for infantry divisions (and by going by the pre-alpha build I have, most MP is used to preplenish losses from combat). Also the starting MP will be low.

Ah, I see... so the starting MP values are not going to be the values given in your earlier post, but instead, revised downward?

When war breaks out the powers will be given an option to call for first round volunteers, the second round, first round draft, second round draft, etc. (at least that is the way I see it being done). If you continue upon the draft a IC/dissent hit will kick in which should cripple number of IC's you have.

Quite an effective system, I think, but it'd be difficult to implement effectively. Are you planning on using events, specialized techs, or a bit of both? Either way, the 'rounds' of volunteers/drafts will spread out the mobilization MP...I like this.

Also I believe there will be some doctrines that will represent some countries having larger divisions thus costing them more MP to recruit a vanilla divison.

Another good idea! I apologize for criticizing you...you seem to have thought this out meticulously, and in good fashion, too!
 
Originally posted by Thufir Hawat
Ah, I see... so the starting MP values are not going to be the values given in your earlier post, but instead, revised downward?

Quite an effective system, I think, but it'd be difficult to implement effectively. Are you planning on using events, specialized techs, or a bit of both? Either way, the 'rounds' of volunteers/drafts will spread out the mobilization MP...I like this.

Well the numbers should be close to what was given, at least I think so (if they are the numbers I am thinking about).

Well the mobilization should be handled by events. What I believe planned is that the starting MP will be low, with each countries standing armies on the map. Then when war is declared, an event fires that places the reserves on the map(with the appropriate MP for those divisions removed from the MP total). Also another event fires soon after that that calls for volunteers, which gives the first MP bonus. Then using triggers that (IIRC there is a manpwer is greater than event trigger), when MP drops below a certain number (see example below) the next MP bonus event should fire, and so on. As the MP events go further on the penalties will be greater. At least that is the way I think it is going to happen.

I think there is a draft/conscription home tech. If so, it may be used a trigger for whether how far you can go in the mobilizaton events.

EX)

NOT
{
manpower = 1000
}

Originally posted by Thufir Hawat

Another good idea! I apologize for criticizing you...you seem to have thought this out meticulously, and in good fashion, too!

Thanks. Hopefully it will all work out in the end, but in really it is playtesting that will vindicate whether all this work proves that it was a good idea.
 
Originally posted by Thufir Hawat
I think it appropriate to insert this constructive criticism of the MP values here.

With the 1.04 patch having reduced MP values for all infantry units in half, so that now one inf. division = 10 MP, the numbers as they are now are somewhat absurd.[...]

This does in fact not matter at all, since we are free to edit the MP cost for all units ourselves. Since we also have decided to go for 1 MP = 1 000 men, this means that we would probably assign a cost of around 15 - 20 MP for most divisional types.

/Johan
 
Okay I was wrong. I thought the base was 10 MP for a vanilla division, but fifteen is probably better. Have you decided yet what each attached battalion (artillery, engineer, etc.) is going to cost extra MP wise? Are they the same or can they be different for each one?
 
Originally posted by shdwknightx
Okay I was wrong. I thought the base was 10 MP for a vanilla division, but fifteen is probably better. Have you decided yet what each attached battalion (artillery, engineer, etc.) is going to cost extra MP wise? Are they the same or can they be different for each one?

Ok, but your figures are still based on 1 MP = 1 000 men, so the numbers are still correct, right? Well, I think that one WWI-division (for most countries) included more men than an ordinary WWII-division, so I think 15-20 MP should be better than 10. For brigades, I haven't decided on anything yet, but probably something like 5 MP? And te numbers can be different for each type.

/Johan
 
Just a quick thought: Remember to deduct the standing armies from the initial MP pool.

On Brigades: Methinks that AA and AT brigades should not be used or only unlocked late in the game. I havent read all of the treads in this forum so maybe you have already thought of that.
 
Originally posted by Johan Elisson
Ok, but your figures are still based on 1 MP = 1 000 men, so the numbers are still correct, right? Well, I think that one WWI-division (for most countries) included more men than an ordinary WWII-division, so I think 15-20 MP should be better than 10. For brigades, I haven't decided on anything yet, but probably something like 5 MP? And te numbers can be different for each type.

/Johan

Yes the numbers are based on 1 MP = 1000 men (And 1 province MP = 100 men). Depending on which country your talking about depends on what the size of the divisions were.

IIRC most of the Western powers were around 12000 strong, later in the war around 9000. The Russians, Bulgarians, and the US had division strength between 20000~25000 men.

I would make engineer/artillery be around a third of the MP cost of a vanilla division (so 5 MP if the vanilla division is 15 MP), rounded up if needs be.

The others I would make a slight bit cheaper maybe 1 or 2 MP than an engineer or artillery.
 
No, you misunderstand. 1 MP = 1000 men, but as a resource in the provinces (where it says steel = xxx amount, coal = xxx, etc.) 1 MP there = .1 MP. That is why places like London has a MP of 30...or 3 monthly MP.
 
I think Montenegro's manpower is way too low. Montenegro had a population of almost 500,000 and a standing army of 45,000 at the beginning of the war. If one division = 20 MP, that means it has to wait till 1924 to build its first new division, which just wasn't the case. Montenegro could easily mobilize 100,000 men.
 
Originally posted by SteVuk
I think Montenegro's manpower is way too low. Montenegro had a population of almost 500,000 and a standing army of 45,000 at the beginning of the war. If one division = 20 MP, that means it has to wait till 1924 to build its first new division, which just wasn't the case. Montenegro could easily mobilize 100,000 men.

The number we had is from an encyclopedia from 1913, stating Montenegro's population was 285,000. Since this is where all of our numbers came from, for consistency I am willing to leave alone as is. Unless you can back up your claim with sources.