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So, a question. I've been interested in the Setites for a while, but roleplaying-wise, I still have difficulties wrapping my head around how their ideology/philosophy works. Maybe you can tell me if my interpretation of them is correct or not.
The way I see it, they're basically an Ancient Egyptian-aesthetic twist on the Cainitism religion we already have in vanilla CK3. Following standard Gnostic principles, Cainians viewed the material as bad and the spiritual as good and divine. Unique to the Cainians (or at least the Paradox take on them) was the conclusion that in that case, the spiritual should be achieved by destroying the physical world and ourselves through sin. This is what the Setites are trying to accomplish with all their corruption games. They worship Set in his aspect as a chaos deity, and also like drawing parallels to chaos (and snake) deities from other mythologies. He is styled a savior and liberator who brings absolute freedom and has the power to break his worshippers out of the shackles of the material world, into the spiritual and divine. In that sense, it is fitting that the modern Setites (as the Ministry) would come to align themselves with the more "progressive" and countercultural vampire faction, the Anarchs.
That about right?
The way I see it, they're basically an Ancient Egyptian-aesthetic twist on the Cainitism religion we already have in vanilla CK3. Following standard Gnostic principles, Cainians viewed the material as bad and the spiritual as good and divine. Unique to the Cainians (or at least the Paradox take on them) was the conclusion that in that case, the spiritual should be achieved by destroying the physical world and ourselves through sin. This is what the Setites are trying to accomplish with all their corruption games. They worship Set in his aspect as a chaos deity, and also like drawing parallels to chaos (and snake) deities from other mythologies. He is styled a savior and liberator who brings absolute freedom and has the power to break his worshippers out of the shackles of the material world, into the spiritual and divine. In that sense, it is fitting that the modern Setites (as the Ministry) would come to align themselves with the more "progressive" and countercultural vampire faction, the Anarchs.
That about right?
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Settites believe corruption is good, that if you hold onto order or purity within yourself you are holding on to harmful lies that harm your spirit. To be free you have to throw aside all your morals and indulge in what you saw as sinful.
Settites align themselves with themselves, they sell vices and can get anything for a price, but thats the front. Really they are driven to make people corrupt. Cos they're just based on the adam and eve snake cos snakes. They'll sell you exactly what you want but because they want you to 'fall' and do the forbidden thing, and the money is more there to make you indulge in mammon and made have to steal to afford. If you lived in a society where spending money was a virtue and charity was sinful, they'd be giving stuff away for free to tempt you into partaking in charity.
Like their motive is, want you to break your morals, whatever they may be, with the end goal of once the whole world is corrupt and free from believing in right and wrong, then Chaos can fall and Set can return. Or they just do it because their curse gives them a compulsion to do so and if they don't corrupt someone they get antsy.
It doesn't entirely make sense as they were written to be villains, so more thought went into what challenge does this offer player not, why would this character do this.
The ministry side of the settites are a side on their own? neutrals who pretend to be all about just war profiteering and black market but are actually about spreading their own power, all connected back to ancient egypt LARPers who control everything.
Then there are other camps that don't have the authority and will work with anyone who allows them to be corrupty.
And Kemintiri who wants to kill all the settites so she can um?, turn everyone into mummys and save the world from evil? or something like that, I don't really remember.
For in the mod, I think there are like 3 ideologies to play?
1. The egypt ones, who want to have one big hegemony that's all them. Corrupt people, but all in service of building new branches and growing power so Egypt can rule the world.
2. the europe ones, Khaytall and stuff, just wanna corrupt people. No big political goal. If you corrupt one person that's a good days work. Work with whatever side will have you as long you get to corrupt people.
3. Osiris catiffs (good vampires) and Kemintiri (isis crazy) who want to kill all the other settites
does help?
Settites align themselves with themselves, they sell vices and can get anything for a price, but thats the front. Really they are driven to make people corrupt. Cos they're just based on the adam and eve snake cos snakes. They'll sell you exactly what you want but because they want you to 'fall' and do the forbidden thing, and the money is more there to make you indulge in mammon and made have to steal to afford. If you lived in a society where spending money was a virtue and charity was sinful, they'd be giving stuff away for free to tempt you into partaking in charity.
Like their motive is, want you to break your morals, whatever they may be, with the end goal of once the whole world is corrupt and free from believing in right and wrong, then Chaos can fall and Set can return. Or they just do it because their curse gives them a compulsion to do so and if they don't corrupt someone they get antsy.
It doesn't entirely make sense as they were written to be villains, so more thought went into what challenge does this offer player not, why would this character do this.
The ministry side of the settites are a side on their own? neutrals who pretend to be all about just war profiteering and black market but are actually about spreading their own power, all connected back to ancient egypt LARPers who control everything.
Then there are other camps that don't have the authority and will work with anyone who allows them to be corrupty.
And Kemintiri who wants to kill all the settites so she can um?, turn everyone into mummys and save the world from evil? or something like that, I don't really remember.
For in the mod, I think there are like 3 ideologies to play?
1. The egypt ones, who want to have one big hegemony that's all them. Corrupt people, but all in service of building new branches and growing power so Egypt can rule the world.
2. the europe ones, Khaytall and stuff, just wanna corrupt people. No big political goal. If you corrupt one person that's a good days work. Work with whatever side will have you as long you get to corrupt people.
3. Osiris catiffs (good vampires) and Kemintiri (isis crazy) who want to kill all the other settites
does help?
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There have been good answers both in your post and Orinsul's one but to summarize, they see Ra (their archenemy) as an oppressive deity that chained humanity to rules, laws and civilization as a whole. Set is the liberator.
That doesn't really make them "freedom vampires" though, as they reveal in everything forbidden by common rules (and sometimes forbidden for good reasons), and a "Setite victory" would probably be a collapse to almost prehistoric level of human organization.
In the mod, and in Dark Ages, you have the "main branch" Setites (Via Set) who follow closely Set's words and, ironically, follow the clan's hierarchy.
They have a small subbranch (Path of subversion) who tries to target large-scale institutions instead of people.
Then you have the Via Apep who are the "heretics" (mainly Europeans Setites and Khay'tall crew), they want corruption for corruption sake and their own perverse enjoyment. Very self centered and without any pretense of wanting to "free the world".
There are obviously even more minor subbranches (the Norse Setites, the Osiris, Kemintiri etc) but that's the main gist of it.
In modern, the Via Apep's crew becomes more and more important until the V5 schism occurs between the Ministry and the Church of Set.
The Ministry basically forgot Set (or pretends to) and uses other religious symbols. They joined the Anarchs because, well, the Anarchs are less control freaks than the Camarilla and also easier to manipulate and profit from.
The Church of Set is still mostly the same as the Via Set of Dark Ages, saving the world from Ra's oppression and preparing Set's glorious return (any day now).
That doesn't really make them "freedom vampires" though, as they reveal in everything forbidden by common rules (and sometimes forbidden for good reasons), and a "Setite victory" would probably be a collapse to almost prehistoric level of human organization.
In the mod, and in Dark Ages, you have the "main branch" Setites (Via Set) who follow closely Set's words and, ironically, follow the clan's hierarchy.
They have a small subbranch (Path of subversion) who tries to target large-scale institutions instead of people.
Then you have the Via Apep who are the "heretics" (mainly Europeans Setites and Khay'tall crew), they want corruption for corruption sake and their own perverse enjoyment. Very self centered and without any pretense of wanting to "free the world".
There are obviously even more minor subbranches (the Norse Setites, the Osiris, Kemintiri etc) but that's the main gist of it.
In modern, the Via Apep's crew becomes more and more important until the V5 schism occurs between the Ministry and the Church of Set.
The Ministry basically forgot Set (or pretends to) and uses other religious symbols. They joined the Anarchs because, well, the Anarchs are less control freaks than the Camarilla and also easier to manipulate and profit from.
The Church of Set is still mostly the same as the Via Set of Dark Ages, saving the world from Ra's oppression and preparing Set's glorious return (any day now).
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How do you do this? By which I mean which buttons do I need to click?
The only way I know use transmogrification is to do the following steps:
1) right click on a mortal at my location and start a "Ghoul" scheme targeting them
3) wait till it finishes
4) right click on myself, and under vampiric actions select "Manipulate ghouls".
5) this makes a list of everyone I have ghouled pop up, I select the ghoul I want to transmogrify and it gives me a list of options for how to manipulate them where transmogrify is one of the options. Selecting that and clicking the big button labelled "Manipulate Ghoul" starts the transmogrification events.
However no matter how many Vicissitude perks I might have I can't do step 1 as a revenant/ghoul/bloodgorged, only as a vampire.
If I try to use the "share the gifts of vitae" as a substitute, the process instead fail at step 4, since "manipulate ghoul" doesn't show up as a personal interaction.
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Oh, so they're basically just anarcho-primitivists!
Jokes aside, thanks, you two, I think I get it now. I almost got confused again when I read the White Wolf Wiki entry for the Via Apep, which says "This view is anathema to Setites on the Road of Set, as Set himself hates chaos and its manifestations", but I think I got the distinction down now.
Materially, they're all doing the same, but the reasoning and theological system is slightly different.
The Road of Set is the heavily Gnostic version. Ra is their Demiurge and Set their Monad. They do not worship chaos or corruption, it's just a means to an end. Once the material world has been fully destabilized, the imprisoned Monad-Set can be freed from Demiurge-Ra's shackles and presumably lead the faithful into some kind of paradise. I'm not sure how that would look, but I imagine it'd be a state of pure spirit and bliss or the like.
The Path of Subversion just follows different methods, but mostly agrees with the theology. It sounds to me that they're unpopular with the main road because those consider individual corruption an art form, all Biblical Serpent-like.
Meanwhile, the Road of Apep do not follow the Gnostic liberation model (much?). They're mostly just chaos worshippers in the true sense, in that they consider a state of chaos a sacred experience and form of being where you're untouched by Ra. I'm guessing they'd still pay lip service to the revival of Set and liberation and such, but they're mostly living in the present. This also explains the hierarchy thing. The Road of Set wants to submit to Monad-Set, hence why they're hierarchical, and they can also work more effectively towards that goal with a higher level of organization and structure. Since chaos is not sacred to them for its own sake, that is not a betrayal of their beliefs. Whereas the Road of Apep views Set as less important, just a symbol or metaphor for chaos, which is everywhere, so they can submerge themselves in it everywhere and don't need any particular authority to follow.
Neither variant believes in freedom as we conventionally know it as a goal for its own sake, though it is an adjacent concept, especially for the Road of Apep, I would imagine.
As I understand, the Ministry is basically just the Road of Apep under a fancy new name, or rather, its logical conclusion. Because they mainly worship chaos, not Set in particular, they have an easier time breaking away from that aspect of the faith.
Jokes aside, thanks, you two, I think I get it now. I almost got confused again when I read the White Wolf Wiki entry for the Via Apep, which says "This view is anathema to Setites on the Road of Set, as Set himself hates chaos and its manifestations", but I think I got the distinction down now.
Materially, they're all doing the same, but the reasoning and theological system is slightly different.
The Road of Set is the heavily Gnostic version. Ra is their Demiurge and Set their Monad. They do not worship chaos or corruption, it's just a means to an end. Once the material world has been fully destabilized, the imprisoned Monad-Set can be freed from Demiurge-Ra's shackles and presumably lead the faithful into some kind of paradise. I'm not sure how that would look, but I imagine it'd be a state of pure spirit and bliss or the like.
The Path of Subversion just follows different methods, but mostly agrees with the theology. It sounds to me that they're unpopular with the main road because those consider individual corruption an art form, all Biblical Serpent-like.
Meanwhile, the Road of Apep do not follow the Gnostic liberation model (much?). They're mostly just chaos worshippers in the true sense, in that they consider a state of chaos a sacred experience and form of being where you're untouched by Ra. I'm guessing they'd still pay lip service to the revival of Set and liberation and such, but they're mostly living in the present. This also explains the hierarchy thing. The Road of Set wants to submit to Monad-Set, hence why they're hierarchical, and they can also work more effectively towards that goal with a higher level of organization and structure. Since chaos is not sacred to them for its own sake, that is not a betrayal of their beliefs. Whereas the Road of Apep views Set as less important, just a symbol or metaphor for chaos, which is everywhere, so they can submerge themselves in it everywhere and don't need any particular authority to follow.
Neither variant believes in freedom as we conventionally know it as a goal for its own sake, though it is an adjacent concept, especially for the Road of Apep, I would imagine.
As I understand, the Ministry is basically just the Road of Apep under a fancy new name, or rather, its logical conclusion. Because they mainly worship chaos, not Set in particular, they have an easier time breaking away from that aspect of the faith.
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I think Bloodgorged is a bit bugged atm. You can't use summon from presence either.
I'm not really knowledgeable in the Vici deeper script to be honest, so there might be issues like being somehow tied to the vampire trait as well as the perks themselves.
For the Setites discussion, that except might be relevant to your comprehension of their goals :
So you can see against what they fight. And everything springs from here.
For the Setites discussion, that except might be relevant to your comprehension of their goals :
So you can see against what they fight. And everything springs from here.
Hey guys, just a suggestion: When you complete the Tremere objective with Etrius or one of his spawn perhaps they should get a new house modifier? The description: "The chosen regent of Tremere leads a stalwart defense at the helm of a battered clan. An unenviable position." seems a kind of odd if not a downright lie when you have dominated the Tzimisce and Ventrue of Hungary to lord it over Eastern Europe.
Most houses description are only there for flavor really, and can easily be irrelevant deep in a game that is diverging heavily from canon.
The objectives will likely get a pass to update when the artifacts come with Royal Court. Many use character modifiers to somewhat represent those right now.
The objectives will likely get a pass to update when the artifacts come with Royal Court. Many use character modifiers to somewhat represent those right now.
Hi I was wondering if their is way to become a vampire while playing as a hunter/ human and if so what is it because I can’t seem to figure it out.
Yes, sort of.
First, hunters with true faith can not be embraced.
Second, we have not scripted a special event for it to happen to a player character hutner.
So, the thing to do is to switch to playing a vampire and have them capture your hunter character and embrace them. Then switch back to the embraced hunter character.
That is correct, specifically you can't start the embrace scheme on landed characters but the scheme can happily work on them (meaning that it doesn't cancel if they become landed after you start the scheme but before the scheme ends). I was looking at the code for that earlier today to amuse myself.
Fun fact gaining true faith after scheme start, also doesn't cancel the scheme so that might be an, exceptionally convoluted and likely to fail but valid, way to get a vampire with true faith that isn't one of the few that start with it.
(also fun fact gaining the "my blood burns" trait does cancel it)
True Faith can also be acquired, for a vampire, as one of the outcomes of the French regional event that happens before 1300.
I just lost my brother, he was executed by his liege (whom I have now seduced and plan to diablerize; after which I will routinely murder his entire line)
Can I resurrect my dear brother? Is there anything I can do? My nephew is so spiteful
Edit: My brother and I are both 5th generation Lasombra children of Tubalcain Tubalcain. He was "executed" by this POS in Novgorod, but I'm wondering whether he was diablerized... I reloaded my save multiple times in my attempts to save him, but I couldn't get a save far enough back to complete a scheme and my brother died on the same date every time. If my brother was diablerized, I wonder what his chances are of taking control of this Novgorod spawn? My brother was almost 1300yo.
Thoughts?
Should I just keep this guy in my back pocket to protect my nephew, and hope that my brother takes over?
What will our father think when he awakens from Torpor?!
Can I resurrect my dear brother? Is there anything I can do? My nephew is so spiteful
Edit: My brother and I are both 5th generation Lasombra children of Tubalcain Tubalcain. He was "executed" by this POS in Novgorod, but I'm wondering whether he was diablerized... I reloaded my save multiple times in my attempts to save him, but I couldn't get a save far enough back to complete a scheme and my brother died on the same date every time. If my brother was diablerized, I wonder what his chances are of taking control of this Novgorod spawn? My brother was almost 1300yo.
Thoughts?
Should I just keep this guy in my back pocket to protect my nephew, and hope that my brother takes over?
What will our father think when he awakens from Torpor?!
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You can't resurrect dead characters. The AI doesn't try to diablerize (except in very specific cases), so it was "just" an execution, so no chances of the character taking back control.
I don't know what Tubalcain will think, except that the guy is known to keep a grudge, still vengeful against Mithras millennia after for a perceived slight so he will probably be as annoyed as you are.
I don't know what Tubalcain will think, except that the guy is known to keep a grudge, still vengeful against Mithras millennia after for a perceived slight so he will probably be as annoyed as you are.
I'm have the smithy sharpen my blade then!
Mwuahahhahaa!
It's a shame, but I think I can make this work in my favour. I diablerized three Methuselah; when/if my father is slain, then I will become house head (everyone is dropping like flies, so I honestly expect it)You can't resurrect dead characters. The AI doesn't try to diablerize (except in very specific cases), so it was "just" an execution, so no chances of the character taking back control.
I don't know what Tubalcain will think, except that the guy is known to keep a grudge, still vengeful against Mithras millennia after for a perceived slight so he will probably be as annoyed as you are.
I won't, er... I won't lose my consciousness to one of them I hope.