Tinto Maps #12 Germany Feedback

Bauer Maggott · Feb 17, 2025

Concernig Nassau:
In the Changes you mntion adding :

Nassau Dillenburg

Nassau Idstein

Nassau Siegen

Nassau Weilburg

though on the map it looks more like

Nassau Hadamar
Nassau Idstein
Nassau Siegen
Nassau Weilburg

Now according to in "Geschichte des Landes Hessen" in 1337 specificly the following states existed (the edition is from like 1972 though):

Idstein-Weilburg
Dillenburg-Siegen
Hadamar

Though just in case i am reading it incorrectly here is a Picture of the relavant Page of the book (hope its readable) :

source: Karl E. Demandt, Geschichte des Landes Hessen, Revidierter Nachdruck der zweiten neubearbeiteten und erweiterten Auflage 1972, Kassel, 1980

Tissaia · Feb 17, 2025

ibvfteh said:
Czechoslovak is any grouping of Czech and Slovak. It is ether Czech-Slovak in two words or Czechoslovak in one word

That distinction is specifically used by linguists to avoid confusion.

franciscusIG · Feb 17, 2025

Pavía said:
Hello, and welcome to another Tinto Maps Feedback post! Today we will look at the review of Germany, or to be more precise, the remaining lands of the HRE that were not covered in previous updates. Let's look first at the list of changes:

ADDITIONS

Added the following:

Locations (46 + 5 Lakes + several Wastelands)

Achim

Annaburg

Aschendorf

Baden im Aargau

Beichlingen

Bochum

Bonndorf

Bremervörde

Bützow

Delmenhorst

Disentis

Ebstorf

Erbach

Freyburg

Fürstenberg

Gotha

Heiligenhafen

Helfenstein

Illereichen

Immenstadt

Isenhagen

La Roche-sur-Foron

Landau

Lüchow

Malchow

Marienstern

Meinersen

Meisenheim

Neustadt an der Haardt

Ohrdruf

Oppenheim

Pinneberg

Pritzwalk

Sallanches

Saulgau

Solingen

Stockach

Toggenburg

Třeboň

Treuenbrietzen

Wertingen

Winsen an der Aller

Wittenberge

Wolhusen

Wurzen

Zossen

Lakes

Lake Chiemsee

Lake Lucerne

Lake Müritz

Lake Starnberg

Lake Zürich

Wastelands

Divided many Wastelands in more pieces.

TAGs (52)

Aosta

Beeskow-Starkow

Beichlingen

Belmont (Switzerland)

Brandenburg (Bishopric)

Colmar (Free City)

Disentis

Ellwangen

Everstein

Falkenstein

Fürstenberg

Gleichen

God's House League

Grey League

Gruyère

Gurk

Hachberg (Baden)

Haguenau

Heidenheim

Helfenstein

Hohenzollern

Holstein Pinneberg

Jever

Kirchberg

Landau

Lebus (Bishopric)

Lichtenberg

Manderscheid

Meissen (Bishopric)

Mesocco

Mulhouse (Free City)

Murbach

Nassau Dillenburg

Nassau Idstein

Nassau Siegen

Nassau Weilburg

Nellenburg

Nidda

Pfalz Simmern Zweibrücken

Riedesel

Rietberg

Saarwerden

Sausenberg

Strasbourg (Free City)

Toggenburg

Truhendingen

Tübingen

Veldenz

Waldeck

Wernigerode

Wied

Characters

bdb_ludwig_schenk_von_neindorf (Bishopric of Brandenburg)

bhl_friedrich_von_beichlingen

bhl_friedrich_von_bleichlingen (Count of Bleichlingen)

blb_stefan_ii (Bishopric of Lebus)

bms_withego_ii_colditz (Bishopric of Meissen)

gln_albrecht_ii

gln_albrecht_iii

gln_ernst_i

gln_ernst_ii

gln_ernst_iii

gln_ernst_iv

gln_ernst_v

gln_erwin_i

gln_erwin_ii

gln_heinrich_i

gln_heinrich_iii

gln_heinrich_iv

gln_herrmann_iv

gln_lambert_i

gln_lambert_ii

gry_agnes_de_gruyere

gry_catherine_de_la_tour_chatillon

gry_jean_de_montsalvens

gry_pierre_i_de_gruyere

gry_pierre_ii_de_gruyere

gry_pierre_iii_de_gruyere

gry_pierre_iv_de_gruyere

gry_rodolphe_i_de_gruyere

gry_ulrich_de_gruyere

lic_johann_i_von_lichtenberg

lic_johann_ii_von_lichtenberg

lic_ludwig_i_von_lichtenberg

lic_ludwig_ii_von_lichtenberg

lic_ludwig_iv_von_lichtenberg

lic_verena_von_freiburg

mds_adelheid_von_fischbach

mds_agnes_von_manderscheid

mds_gertrud_von_virneburg

mds_jutta_von_reuland

mds_wilhelm_i_von_manderscheid

mds_wilhelm_ii_von_manderscheid

mds_wilhelm_iii_von_manderscheid

mds_wilhelm_iv_von_manderscheid

nid_engelbert_i

nid_heilwig_von_isenburg

nid_ludwig_ii

nid_lukardis

nsa_henry_ii_nassau

nsa_otto_i_nassau

nsd_johann_i_nassau

nss_henry_i_nassau

nss_otto_ii_nassau

rbg_friedrich_i_von_rietberg

rbg_heinrich_i_von_rietberg

rbg_konrad_i_von_rietberg

rdl_elisabeth_von_eisenbach

rdl_hermann_i_riedesel

rdl_hermann_ii_riedesel

rdl_kraft_i_riedesel

tgg_adelheid_von_griessenberg

tgg_daughter1_von_toggenburg

tgg_daughter2_von_toggenburg

tgg_daughter3_von_toggenburg

tgg_diethelm_i_von_toggenburg

tgg_diethelm_ii_von_toggenburg

tgg_diethelm_v_von_toggenburg

vel_agnes_von_leiningen

vel_agnes_von_veldenz

vel_emicho_von_kyrburg

vel_georg_i_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_i_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_ii_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_iii_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_iv_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_v_von_veldenz

vel_heinrich_ii_von_veldenz

vel_heinrich_von_geroldseck

vel_walter_von_geroldseck

wde_adelaide_von_kleve

wde_adolph_i_von_waldeck

wde_adolph_ii_von_waldeck

wde_armgard_von_waldeck

wde_dietrich_von_waldeck

wde_elisabeth_von_waldeck

wde_henry_iii_von_waldeck

wde_henry_iv_von_waldeck

wde_henry_v_von_waldeck

wde_mechthild_von_waldeck

wde_otto_i_von_waldeck

wde_otto_ii_von_waldeck

wgo_albrecht_v_von_wernigerode

wgo_gebhard_i_von_wernigerode

wgo_helene_von_braunschweig

wgo_konrad_i_von_wernigerode

wgo_konrad_ii_von_wernigerode

wgo_konrad_iii_von_wernigerode

wgo_konrad_iv_von_wernigerode

Dynamic Names

Added Czech, German (including Lower, Central and Upper), Polabian, Rhaetian (Friulian, Ladin and Romansh) and Sorbian Dynamic Names

CORRECTIONS

Renamed the following:

Locations (only corrections. Additionally renamed all locations to standardized form):

Aalen to Ellwangen

Aschersleben to Ballenstedt

Bad Hofgastein to Bischofshofen

Beckum to Rietberg

Bernkastel to Birkenfeld

Biedenkopf to Friedberg

Bílina to Husinec

Böblingen to Tübingen

Braunlage to Herzberg am Harz

Bruck an der Mür to Kapfenberg

Bulle to Gruyère

Coesfeld to Horstmar

Deggendorf to Kelheim

Dermbach to Aschach

Donauwörth to Oettingen

Ebermannstadt to Schesslitz

Erlangen to Sulzbach

Fritzlar to Melsungen

Fürth to Nagold

Genthin to Jerichow

Grafendorf to Waidhofen

Greifenstein to Davos

Gronau to Gandersheim

Guardaval to Zuoz

Ilmenau to Schleusingen

Imst to Landneck

Kadaň to Teplá

Kaufbeuren to Krumbach

Langenthal to Burgdorf

Lambach to Ischl

Lüdinghausen to Dulmen

Mariazell to Scheibbs

Montabaur to Wied

Münsingen to Sigmaringen

Olpe to Attendorn

Pfarrkirchen to Griesbach

Rees to Wesel

Rüdesheim to Katzenelnbogen

St. Wendel to Lichtenberg

Schotten to Nidda

Schwarzenberg to Sayda

Sonneberg to Saalfeld

Steinfurt to Rheine

Tábor to Jindřichův Hradec

Tuttlingen to Hohenberg

Vall d'Ossola to Domodossola

Vilsbiburg to Burghausen

Vohenstrauß to Leuchtenberg

Wangen to Waldburg

Westerstede to Friesoythe

Zug to Kyburg

TAGs

Removed (18)

Apolda

Biel/Bienne

Böbingen

Brückenau

Calw

Donauwörth

Eppstein

Hof

Kaufbeuren

Kevernburg

Lüdinghausen

Minden

Offenbach

Parsberg

Schlusselberg

Steinfurt

Wangen

Zeven

Raw Goods

Changed several Raw Goods as suggested

Terrain and Vegetation

Total Review

Locations

Redrew several Locations

And now, to the maps!

Countries:
View attachment 1255391
View attachment 1255392
View attachment 1255393
The first map with no colored wastelands, the second with colored wastelands, and the third, we are showing the entire territory of the HRE, not only Germany.

HRE IO:
View attachment 1255472
This is the updated HRE IO map, with the different categories (Prince-Elector & Archbishop-Elector, Imperial Peasant Republic, Free Imperial City, Imperial Prelate, and Imperial Prince). As usual, take the map mode as WIP (you may notice that it has already changed since the original Tinto Maps post, making it easier to read).

And here you have the current total number of members:

View attachment 1255395
Not all the countries appear in this box, you have to scroll a bit in-game to be able to see the remaining ones.

Locations:
View attachment 1255404
View attachment 1255405
View attachment 1255406
View attachment 1255407
View attachment 1255408
View attachment 1255409

Provinces:
View attachment 1255412
View attachment 1255413
One of our German content designers has reworked the provinces. We've tried to get a balance between those that could directly translate to English, such as the different provinces of Styria, and those that couldn't be translated easily; so for a native German speaker, some will sound a bit weird, but we've tried to be consistent with how we manage it in general.

Areas:
View attachment 1255415

Terrain:
View attachment 1255424
View attachment 1255425
View attachment 1255426
A bunch of changes after your feedback, especially on the Vegetation.

Development:
View attachment 1255429

Harbors:
I've noticed while preparing the Feedback post that we haven't posted the Natural Harbors of Europe, so I'll prepare another separate for them!

Cultures:
View attachment 1255434
There are some adjustments to the cultures, but not big changes.

Languages:
View attachment 1255435
View attachment 1255436
View attachment 1255437
The first map is the dominant languages, the second is the dialects (which, I remind you, is primarily used for flavour, and close to the 'language' linguistical definition), and the third is the court language.

Religions:
View attachment 1255442
Not many changes in the religious map, only a few Waldensians were added to Austria.

Raw Materials:
View attachment 1255445
Lots of changes!

Markets:
View attachment 1255446
We haven't changed the market centers, you may notice some differences with the Tinto Maps post, which depend on the constant balancing we keep doing to this feature.

And that's all for today! Remember that on Friday we will be taking a look at a German country, Bavaria. Cheers!

will we be able to release the removed tags ? Because as a person who is from one of these towns it would be really cool to play as my hometown in Project Ceasar/ Eu5 !

Katana500 · Feb 17, 2025

I would maybe add one additional tag Aschersleben to the province of Ballenstedt

MRhuman666 · Feb 17, 2025

ibvfteh said:
Is "Bay" a translation for German "Gau"?
View attachment 1255552

Here you can see Cologne Bay (which for me sounds like Gulf of London) but also Kraichgau (with gau). Why not just Kölngau?
or this
View attachment 1255554

Its Kölner Bucht (Bay=Bucht), Kölngau fell out of use like 200 years before the start date of Project Caesar. Kraichgau is still called Kraichgau to this day.

MTGian · Feb 17, 2025

Sulphurologist said:
It's unfortunate yeah.
I've been able to let it go, in the sense that peat was used for heating in houses and fuel for urban industries like salt production, and breweries, brick making etc.
I think I haven't seen lumber for heating in the game (iirc?), and I don't think peat was used for metallurgy purposes (also iirc, probably @Mef can correct me here). In that sense, I can agree with pdx for not comparing peat to coal, as it was used more like firewood.

I'd love to see peat extraction as a building to boost urban industries within the same area, or something along those lines.

My understanding is that the Netherlands had an unusual density of urban industries that required heat (add sugar refining to the ones you mentioned). Making heat energy important and modelling peat kind of go together. So, if heat energy doesn't matter, then I could see the justification to not model peat.

But, I think heat energy should be a big deal, so ...

Mder1 · Feb 17, 2025

Is there a particular reason the Bavarian Forest being mountains and the Black Forest (at the least the southern part) just hills?

Palando · Feb 17, 2025

Pavía said:
Pfalz Simmern Zweibrücken, but it looks like an overlook, and that it should probably be incorporated to the Palatinate.

Well, Simmern still was owned by Trier until 1377, so it should again be part of that like in your previous map version.

Pavía · Feb 17, 2025

ibvfteh said:
Is "Bay" a translation for German "Gau"?
View attachment 1255552

Here you can see Cologne Bay (which for me sounds like Gulf of London) but also Kraichgau (with gau). Why not just Kölngau?
or this
View attachment 1255554

From one of our German CDs: "No, Bay has no relation to the word Gau, it is the geographical term for this area. In German it is called 'Kölner Bucht'. 'Cologne Bay' is the compromise between our standard and consistency within the game, alternative names are 'Cologne Lowlands', 'Cologne Bight' or you could say 'Cologne Basin'."

ibvfteh · Feb 17, 2025

Pavía said:
Hello, and welcome to another Tinto Maps Feedback post! Today we will look at the review of Germany, or to be more precise, the remaining lands of the HRE that were not covered in previous updates. Let's look first at the list of changes:

ADDITIONS

Added the following:

Locations (46 + 5 Lakes + several Wastelands)

Achim

Annaburg

Aschendorf

Baden im Aargau

Beichlingen

Bochum

Bonndorf

Bremervörde

Bützow

Delmenhorst

Disentis

Ebstorf

Erbach

Freyburg

Fürstenberg

Gotha

Heiligenhafen

Helfenstein

Illereichen

Immenstadt

Isenhagen

La Roche-sur-Foron

Landau

Lüchow

Malchow

Marienstern

Meinersen

Meisenheim

Neustadt an der Haardt

Ohrdruf

Oppenheim

Pinneberg

Pritzwalk

Sallanches

Saulgau

Solingen

Stockach

Toggenburg

Třeboň

Treuenbrietzen

Wertingen

Winsen an der Aller

Wittenberge

Wolhusen

Wurzen

Zossen

Lakes

Lake Chiemsee

Lake Lucerne

Lake Müritz

Lake Starnberg

Lake Zürich

Wastelands

Divided many Wastelands in more pieces.

TAGs (52)

Aosta

Beeskow-Starkow

Beichlingen

Belmont (Switzerland)

Brandenburg (Bishopric)

Colmar (Free City)

Disentis

Ellwangen

Everstein

Falkenstein

Fürstenberg

Gleichen

God's House League

Grey League

Gruyère

Gurk

Hachberg (Baden)

Haguenau

Heidenheim

Helfenstein

Hohenzollern

Holstein Pinneberg

Jever

Kirchberg

Landau

Lebus (Bishopric)

Lichtenberg

Manderscheid

Meissen (Bishopric)

Mesocco

Mulhouse (Free City)

Murbach

Nassau Dillenburg

Nassau Idstein

Nassau Siegen

Nassau Weilburg

Nellenburg

Nidda

Pfalz Simmern Zweibrücken

Riedesel

Rietberg

Saarwerden

Sausenberg

Strasbourg (Free City)

Toggenburg

Truhendingen

Tübingen

Veldenz

Waldeck

Wernigerode

Wied

Characters

bdb_ludwig_schenk_von_neindorf (Bishopric of Brandenburg)

bhl_friedrich_von_beichlingen

bhl_friedrich_von_bleichlingen (Count of Bleichlingen)

blb_stefan_ii (Bishopric of Lebus)

bms_withego_ii_colditz (Bishopric of Meissen)

gln_albrecht_ii

gln_albrecht_iii

gln_ernst_i

gln_ernst_ii

gln_ernst_iii

gln_ernst_iv

gln_ernst_v

gln_erwin_i

gln_erwin_ii

gln_heinrich_i

gln_heinrich_iii

gln_heinrich_iv

gln_herrmann_iv

gln_lambert_i

gln_lambert_ii

gry_agnes_de_gruyere

gry_catherine_de_la_tour_chatillon

gry_jean_de_montsalvens

gry_pierre_i_de_gruyere

gry_pierre_ii_de_gruyere

gry_pierre_iii_de_gruyere

gry_pierre_iv_de_gruyere

gry_rodolphe_i_de_gruyere

gry_ulrich_de_gruyere

lic_johann_i_von_lichtenberg

lic_johann_ii_von_lichtenberg

lic_ludwig_i_von_lichtenberg

lic_ludwig_ii_von_lichtenberg

lic_ludwig_iv_von_lichtenberg

lic_verena_von_freiburg

mds_adelheid_von_fischbach

mds_agnes_von_manderscheid

mds_gertrud_von_virneburg

mds_jutta_von_reuland

mds_wilhelm_i_von_manderscheid

mds_wilhelm_ii_von_manderscheid

mds_wilhelm_iii_von_manderscheid

mds_wilhelm_iv_von_manderscheid

nid_engelbert_i

nid_heilwig_von_isenburg

nid_ludwig_ii

nid_lukardis

nsa_henry_ii_nassau

nsa_otto_i_nassau

nsd_johann_i_nassau

nss_henry_i_nassau

nss_otto_ii_nassau

rbg_friedrich_i_von_rietberg

rbg_heinrich_i_von_rietberg

rbg_konrad_i_von_rietberg

rdl_elisabeth_von_eisenbach

rdl_hermann_i_riedesel

rdl_hermann_ii_riedesel

rdl_kraft_i_riedesel

tgg_adelheid_von_griessenberg

tgg_daughter1_von_toggenburg

tgg_daughter2_von_toggenburg

tgg_daughter3_von_toggenburg

tgg_diethelm_i_von_toggenburg

tgg_diethelm_ii_von_toggenburg

tgg_diethelm_v_von_toggenburg

vel_agnes_von_leiningen

vel_agnes_von_veldenz

vel_emicho_von_kyrburg

vel_georg_i_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_i_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_ii_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_iii_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_iv_von_veldenz

vel_gerlach_v_von_veldenz

vel_heinrich_ii_von_veldenz

vel_heinrich_von_geroldseck

vel_walter_von_geroldseck

wde_adelaide_von_kleve

wde_adolph_i_von_waldeck

wde_adolph_ii_von_waldeck

wde_armgard_von_waldeck

wde_dietrich_von_waldeck

wde_elisabeth_von_waldeck

wde_henry_iii_von_waldeck

wde_henry_iv_von_waldeck

wde_henry_v_von_waldeck

wde_mechthild_von_waldeck

wde_otto_i_von_waldeck

wde_otto_ii_von_waldeck

wgo_albrecht_v_von_wernigerode

wgo_gebhard_i_von_wernigerode

wgo_helene_von_braunschweig

wgo_konrad_i_von_wernigerode

wgo_konrad_ii_von_wernigerode

wgo_konrad_iii_von_wernigerode

wgo_konrad_iv_von_wernigerode

Dynamic Names

Added Czech, German (including Lower, Central and Upper), Polabian, Rhaetian (Friulian, Ladin and Romansh) and Sorbian Dynamic Names

CORRECTIONS

Renamed the following:

Locations (only corrections. Additionally renamed all locations to standardized form):

Aalen to Ellwangen

Aschersleben to Ballenstedt

Bad Hofgastein to Bischofshofen

Beckum to Rietberg

Bernkastel to Birkenfeld

Biedenkopf to Friedberg

Bílina to Husinec

Böblingen to Tübingen

Braunlage to Herzberg am Harz

Bruck an der Mür to Kapfenberg

Bulle to Gruyère

Coesfeld to Horstmar

Deggendorf to Kelheim

Dermbach to Aschach

Donauwörth to Oettingen

Ebermannstadt to Schesslitz

Erlangen to Sulzbach

Fritzlar to Melsungen

Fürth to Nagold

Genthin to Jerichow

Grafendorf to Waidhofen

Greifenstein to Davos

Gronau to Gandersheim

Guardaval to Zuoz

Ilmenau to Schleusingen

Imst to Landneck

Kadaň to Teplá

Kaufbeuren to Krumbach

Langenthal to Burgdorf

Lambach to Ischl

Lüdinghausen to Dulmen

Mariazell to Scheibbs

Montabaur to Wied

Münsingen to Sigmaringen

Olpe to Attendorn

Pfarrkirchen to Griesbach

Rees to Wesel

Rüdesheim to Katzenelnbogen

St. Wendel to Lichtenberg

Schotten to Nidda

Schwarzenberg to Sayda

Sonneberg to Saalfeld

Steinfurt to Rheine

Tábor to Jindřichův Hradec

Tuttlingen to Hohenberg

Vall d'Ossola to Domodossola

Vilsbiburg to Burghausen

Vohenstrauß to Leuchtenberg

Wangen to Waldburg

Westerstede to Friesoythe

Zug to Kyburg

TAGs

Removed (18)

Apolda

Biel/Bienne

Böbingen

Brückenau

Calw

Donauwörth

Eppstein

Hof

Kaufbeuren

Kevernburg

Lüdinghausen

Minden

Offenbach

Parsberg

Schlusselberg

Steinfurt

Wangen

Zeven

Raw Goods

Changed several Raw Goods as suggested

Terrain and Vegetation

Total Review

Locations

Redrew several Locations

And now, to the maps!

Countries:
View attachment 1255391
View attachment 1255392
View attachment 1255393
The first map with no colored wastelands, the second with colored wastelands, and the third, we are showing the entire territory of the HRE, not only Germany.

HRE IO:
View attachment 1255472
This is the updated HRE IO map, with the different categories (Prince-Elector & Archbishop-Elector, Imperial Peasant Republic, Free Imperial City, Imperial Prelate, and Imperial Prince). As usual, take the map mode as WIP (you may notice that it has already changed since the original Tinto Maps post, making it easier to read).

And here you have the current total number of members:

View attachment 1255395
Not all the countries appear in this box, you have to scroll a bit in-game to be able to see the remaining ones.

Locations:
View attachment 1255404
View attachment 1255405
View attachment 1255406
View attachment 1255407
View attachment 1255408
View attachment 1255409

Provinces:
View attachment 1255412
View attachment 1255413
One of our German content designers has reworked the provinces. We've tried to get a balance between those that could directly translate to English, such as the different provinces of Styria, and those that couldn't be translated easily; so for a native German speaker, some will sound a bit weird, but we've tried to be consistent with how we manage it in general.

Areas:
View attachment 1255415

Terrain:
View attachment 1255424
View attachment 1255425
View attachment 1255426
A bunch of changes after your feedback, especially on the Vegetation.

Development:
View attachment 1255429

Harbors:
I've noticed while preparing the Feedback post that we haven't posted the Natural Harbors of Europe, so I'll prepare another separate for them!

Cultures:
View attachment 1255434
There are some adjustments to the cultures, but not big changes.

Languages:
View attachment 1255435
View attachment 1255436
View attachment 1255437
The first map is the dominant languages, the second is the dialects (which, I remind you, is primarily used for flavour, and close to the 'language' linguistical definition), and the third is the court language.

Religions:
View attachment 1255442
Not many changes in the religious map, only a few Waldensians were added to Austria.

Raw Materials:
View attachment 1255445
Lots of changes!

Markets:
View attachment 1255446
We haven't changed the market centers, you may notice some differences with the Tinto Maps post, which depend on the constant balancing we keep doing to this feature.

And that's all for today! Remember that on Friday we will be taking a look at a German country, Bavaria. Cheers!

something wrong with the areas here. Basel in Neuchatel?

AHumpierRogue · Feb 17, 2025

I feel like Bohemian locations are very big relative to their surroundings. Is it just me? Like compared to all countries around them they look huge.

I think the games issue with rivers rears it's ugly head still in the market map. See how the market access goes radially outside the market center rather than following the Rhine for example. It's just so unfortunate.

Sulphurologist · Feb 17, 2025

Streamlet said:
Are there any plans to rename Low Franconian to Dutch? I know the reasoning is because it's supposed to represent the historical group of languages, but seeing as the in-game dialect here is literally just called "Dutch" it seems like an unnecessary use of an academic term. It will just reduce readability for the average player, unless they're already into linguistics or love Googling things

'Dutch culture' is a term everyone knows and uses for the modern concept of Dutch.
The language itself was 'Middle Dutch / Diets' at the time, so I can live with that.

Flanders and Southern Brabant were still dominant in the 1300s, population wise, economically and culturally. Using 'Dutch' as the overarching culture name doesn't feel quite right for the time period. Considering the cultures of the Low countries were very similar, but not quite a single thing either, I still think the abstract Low Franconian is preferrable to a concrete 'Dutch' indication.

ibvfteh · Feb 17, 2025

Pavía said:
From one of our German CDs: "No, Bay has no relation to the word Gau, it is the geographical term for this area. In German it is called 'Kölner Bucht'. 'Cologne Bay' is the compromise between our standard and consistency within the game, alternative names are 'Cologne Lowlands', 'Cologne Bight' or you could say 'Cologne Basin'."

So then other provinces with gau suffix will be translated? but with bay I would prefer Cologne Bight or Lowland as bay already is used for sea bays

lazprune · Feb 17, 2025

I think Arpitan should be its own language and not a French dialect.

I am no expert on German cultures but perhaps finding non geographic names would be better since, you know, pops expand and migrate. It will feel weird to have Rhine Franconians populating the Danube and vice-versa...

SPb enjoyer · Feb 17, 2025

Sulphurologist said:
It's unfortunate yeah.
I've been able to let it go, in the sense that peat was used for heating in houses and fuel for urban industries like salt production, and breweries, brick making etc.
I think I haven't seen lumber for heating in the game (iirc?), and I don't think peat was used for metallurgy purposes (also iirc, probably @Mef can correct me here). In that sense, I can agree with pdx for not comparing peat to coal, as it was used more like firewood.

I'd love to see peat extraction as a building to boost urban industries within the same area, or something along those lines.

Probably resources for heating were abstracted in pop’s need for lumber, Johan even wrote that needed amount will be bigger in cold climates

Tavolo87 · Feb 17, 2025

Pavía said:
Why? They already got their reviews.

cause you added almost no location and to both of them the feedback felt very much disregarded (I'm still waiting of an explanation about why there's no Otranto in "terre d'Otranto" btw, given that it was among the top 4 biggest cities in Apulia and has an entire province dedicated to its name but no location)

then there's also the fact that Benevento is there but not Amalfi which is... very sad indeed to say the least

edit : also if you ever intend to put a monastic order dlc for the love of God (pun intended) add Cassino as a location too, given that it had one of the most important Bendectine monasteries in Europe, but I digress

Sulphurologist · Feb 17, 2025

SPb enjoyer said:
Probably resources for heating were abstracted in pop’s need for lumber, Johan even wrote that needed amount will be bigger in cold climates

Welp, f*ck it.

I WANT PEAT BACK THEN.

MRhuman666 · Feb 17, 2025

Koiodoros said:
Also is it just me, or is the Brugge market extremely small compared to neighbouring markets? I don't see how Lübeck could control the trade in East Friesland when Brugge is a lot closer when following the sea. I'd argue the majority of the locations along the Maas traded with Brugge more than Cologne. All of Guelders, Brabant and Utrecht had more trade with Holland and Flanders than Cologne. I'd even argue that Münster should be a part of the Brugge node because a lot of the trade went along the Vecht through Zwolle.

The dutch-german border is too modern anyway. Bentheim, Geldern & Cleves should all be part of the neighbouring "dutch" regions. The "cut-off" line between "dutch" and "german" was not as harsh as it is today. And most of the border states had to decide during the Reformation if they wanted to follow the Dutch Calvinists or German Lutherans, which set them on the course of being consildated into these larger ethnic groups.

Elryos · Feb 17, 2025

Ah, sweet release, Gladbach no longer reaching the Rhine. Praise the Cologne snake!
(Though I would love it if you would cut Neuss into Uerdingen and Neuss.)

On another note Cologne as the sole English name amongst German names sticks out quite a lot. Can we get a Köln there if we get modern names?

matfer13 · Feb 17, 2025

@Pavía you "mispelled" Tyrol

The english name uses a y not an i, that's the German name, considering it's a region that is split between Italy and Austria I think it's more appropriate to use the english name for both tag and area

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