Tinto Talks #10 - 1st of May 2024

[Johan]

Taking the CK3 and Vic3 approach I see.

Imperator

 

[Johan]

But could Ösel also found their own tiny market if they wanted? And presumably cut themselves off from almost everything they don't produce themselves?

yes they could, and then they'd realise it was the worst investment of gold ever..

 

[Johan]

Please Johan can you clarify what pop needs work? You have mentioned it several times it is a thing but you havent explained how it works and how you satisfy it

in a later dd

 

[Johan]

Is it only the market leader that can trade with other markets?

Anyone with merchant capacity in the market can trade

 

[Johan]

How will army supplies work in this "project ceasar". Will it depend on the market, distance and terrain hostility or even all of them? And if it is gonna work like a supply train where you need clear and protected passages for the suplies to come throught completely or a tottaly different concept?

Another concept, but it interacts with markets a bit.

 

[Johan]

One thing I'm wondering regarding cost for shipping goods: is there are significant difference between sea and land shipping?

Here's an example from the early period of the game (Hanseatic League):
A Cog was able to move 40 tons of goods with a crew of 12 men. To move that same amount over land, you needed 40 wagons, 40 men and 160 horses, which was obviously much more expensive.

Trade over sea should be noticeably more efficient than land trade, not just allow access to way more markets all over the world.

Thats abstracted into sea travel costing less capacity to go through

 

[Johan]

Does Praha here benefit from trade between Koln and Pest?

not really.

 

[Johan]

Hm, the low countries are almost entirely in London’s market at game start? That’s interesting.

How do you ”declare independence” economically by creating your own market?

You spend lots of gold primarily.

 

[Johan]

How will market control work when the market owner is a subject country (i.e. Ragusa being a venetian vassal in 1337)?

subject decides

 

[Johan]

I wonder how significant rivers will be in this too since they significantly ease some of the logistics of trade

rivers will impact it

 

[Johan]

I'm also wondering about the Silk Road. Given that terra incognita will still exist, and European traders can't go to China directly at the beginning of the game, will the game be able to simulate the demand for Asian goods in Europe? Can a significant demand for say silk in Constantinople prompt the AI in Persia to import it from further east, prompting the actors in that further east market to import it from China and move it west?

yes, as the prices in China are cheaper than the one in persia and persia is cheaper than lets say the prices in Venice.

 

[Johan]

Will the market owner be able to set export caps for certain nations?

Example: Austria is importing too much of your iron for their army and now you don't have enough for your own army expansion, so you limit them to 4 iron per month.

Should also give a CB, but wouldn't be a total embargo.

Trades only happen AFTER all internal demands in the market are satisfied.

 

[Johan]

If my country is located on the edge of a market, so that my locations have very low market access, can I create an independent market on my own to improve market access of my locations? How difficult is this action?
Is it possible that I have created my own market, but due to the strong attraction of the nearby market, most of my locations will be forced into that market again? (I hope it's true)

yes and yes

 

[Johan]

You also mention that trades must always physically pass through two localities. In the example you've given this is Riga and London, two market centres. But I presume from the way you've phrased it that this isn't always the case. And it's possible for a trade between the Riga and London markets to go through Reval and Hull?

it will go what is the closest path between the market centers. so british imports from canada and such may most likely enter through Liverpool? Swedish imports from outside the baltic when they form their own market would most likely enter through Göteborg

 

[Johan]

1- "You are a great power like i don't know France or the UK and you are so much power full and evryone want to trade with you, is it possible that your trade region can be way WAY bigger than other, like in later game and for exemple colonies want to trade or be part of trade regions of their other lords ? (like i think it will be more profitable for Hong Kong or Boston to be part of the UK trade at least in early game)

Something that is overseas is very very unlikely to be a part of a London Market. Pretty sure that it would be hard to even get a conquered & integrated Lissabon to part of it.

 

[Johan]

Can markets "snake" into others?like London market reaching for some specific locations in paris market.

not really.

 

[Johan]

The north sea was not wasteland in the map from Tinto Talks #2. Has that changed, or are sea provinces far from shore inherently not part of a market?

sea locations that are not adjacent to an ownable location is never part of a market.

 

[Johan]

It looks like, if I'm understanding it correctly, Genoa controls both the Genoa market and the Kaffa market. Are there any special interactions with this (reduced cost to transfer goods between those two markets?) and at what point would the two markets just merge into one?

When they are close enough in distance, it would perhaps be beneficial.. but that case is really very unlikely..

 

[Johan]

Does which market a location belong to entirely determined by market attractiveness? Or can it be intervened by the country?
For example, can a Lowlands country actively leave the London market and join the Paris market? Or the country can only observe market dynamically changes on itself?

You can try to deny market access to London and give market preference to Paris.. in this case its rather likely all your locations move to Paris. Also its probably a loss, as there is a lot of wool in England, and you got a nice cloth industry, and you may not be able to import any from London, as you probably have very very low merchant power there.

 

[Johan]

As much as the HRE borders are terrifying yet exciting to look at on the map, I couldn't help but notice the bordergore of the French Appanages as well. Oof. Fi

One day (not soon), it will be fun to talk about how France works with its unique subjects.