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Tinto Maps #10 - 12th of July 2024 - Syrian Levant & Egypt

Hello everyone, and welcome to another Tinto Maps! We’re back after celebrating the most important victories over Germany and France since the 30 Years War a hard week of work, and we’re ready to share with you the region of the Syrian Levant & Egypt (actually, we’re revealing a bit more of what those regions would be, to cover the complete extension of the Mamlūk Sultanate). Let’s go!

Countries:
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The Mamlūk Sultanate is the main power of the region, a situation achieved after the defeat of the Mongols at the Battles of Ain Jalut and Marj al-Saffar, and the fall of Acre, the last stronghold of the Crusader states in Outremer. The latter's legacy is still handled by the Kingdom of Cyprus, ruled by Hugues IV of Lusignan. Apart from that, we can see the realm of Candia, a subject governed by the Serene Republic of Venice, and some Arabic tribes, such as the Hutaym and the Anizah. Oh, and also, to the south-west, you might have noticed some oases ruled by either the Mamluks, or Fezzan; I opted for not coloring the wastelands, as usual, but also the corridors, a type of terrain present in other GSGs, that we have in Project Caesar. I’ll talk more about them under the ‘Locations’ section of the DD, but I just want to note one more thing: the connection down the Nile is a regular one, with a border existing between the Mamluks and Makuria (the country that controls the small chunk of land at the very south of the image).

Dynasties:
Dynasties.png

The Bahri Mamluks have ruled the Sultanate since they deposed the Ayyubids, almost a century before the start of the game. It could maybe be a bit more accurate to depict Sultan al-Nasir Muhammad as an ibn Qalawun (‘of the lineage of Qalawun’), but the dynastical dynamics of the Mamluk rulers are not so easy to portray, so we opted for the moment to better use Bahriyya. Apart from that, you may also see the neighboring dynasties, such as the already-mentioned House of Lusignan, or the Hethumian of Cilicia.

Locations:
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Here you can see the locations of the entire region, and also closer chunks behind the ‘Spoiler’ button. The most interesting feature to talk about is that of the corridors, something that some of you might remember from ‘Imperator: Rome’, but also something new to the rest. The corridors are empty locations, with no population or resources, but that allows connection between the locations at their sides, for some mechanics that we’ve already mentioned (market access, control), and some others that we haven’t (army movement). This is the way that we’ve chosen to portray the Saharan corridors, that allow for a connection between the Maghreb and the Mashreq, and Western and Central Africa. There are also some regular locations over those corridors, with population, resources, etc., that can be controlled by countries, which portray the desert oases that made for important outposts in the different Saharan routes. Not all the connections are throughout corridors, though; outside of the image, the Nile River valley allows for regular locations all the way down from Egypt to Nubia, the last location held by the Mamluks being that of Aswan, while the first held by Makuria, not shown in the screenshot, being Qasr Ibrim. We will talk more about Nubia and Ethiopia in a future Tinto Maps.

Provinces:
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Usual provinces mapmode; please let us know of any spelling or naming suggestions that come to your mind.

Areas:
Areas.png

A new mapmode that has been requested in previous Tinto Maps, and that we’re now incorporating.

Terrain:
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The climate is dominated by a mix of Mediterranean, Arid, and Cold Arid. The topography of the region is quite flat, with some hills and mountains on Mount Lebanon and Anti-Lebanon, Mount Sinai, and the verge of the Arabian plateau; and some marshland over the Nile Delta, of course. Regarding the vegetation, desert and sparse vegetation dominate most of the region, with some woods and forests over Levant, and the Nile fertile farmlands, the bread basket of the Eastern Mediterranean.

Cultures:
Cultures.png

Here starts the fun… Those countries ruling over the Middle East will face the challenge of managing several different cultural minorities. Libyan, Egyptian, Sa'idi, Bedouin, Ḥijāzī, Najidi (the green one to their right), Levantine, and Iraqi (the light blue at the top right of the picture) are all different regional cultures of Arabic-speaking people. Something interesting is that most of Bedouin pops are tribesmen, instead of peasants, portraying their traditional social organization. Coming to important minority groups, Coptic people are quite important in Egypt, accounting for about 10% of the population of the Mamlūk Sultanate. The other important minority are the Syriacs, as they also account for another 10% of the population, and are a cultural majority in a few locations. Apart from those, there are also Armenians, Kurds, and Turkomans on the divide between Anatolia, Syria, and Jazira, Alawites Shiites in Syria, Mizrahi Jews all over the region, Samaritans in Palestine, and Greeks in Crete, Cyprus, and some in Alexandria. Oh, also the Saharan cultures of the Eastern Berbers and the Toubou over some of the Saharan oases.

Religions:
Religion.png

More fun. In this region, we have:
  • Sunni Muslims
  • Miaphysite Christians
  • Orthodox Christians
  • Shia Muslims
  • Catholic Christians
  • Druzes
  • Jews
  • Nestorian Christians (the ‘label’ we’re using to depict the Church of the East)
  • Samaritans
  • Yazidi

Relating these religions to the previous cultures, we can tell you most of the Arabic-speaking cultures are Sunni Muslims, with some Shia Muslims in Syria and Lebanon. Most of the Coptic are Miaphysite, adhering to the Patriarchate of Alexandria, although some of there still follow the Orthodoxy of Constantinople. The Syriacs are also religiously divided, with some being Nestorians (the current name we have to cover the confessions related to the Church of the East), some Miaphysites, some Orthodox, and even some Catholics in Lebanon. And then we have some cultural-religious minorities, such as the Alawite Shiites, the Druzes (which are of Levantine culture), the Mizrahi Jews, the Samaritans, and the Yazidi (which are of Kurd culture).


Raw Materials:
Raw Materials.png

There are some materials that are more unique to this region, such as the Dates in the arid fringes. The Nile Valley and Delta are incredibly fertile, having plenty of different crops: Wheat, Rice, Legumes, Sugar, Cotton, Fiber Crops (=Linen), etc. Livestock, Wool, and Horses are also important resources for the people across the region. There are also some metals present in the region, such as Copper in Cyprus and around the Red Sea, Iron, Tin, some Lead, and some interesting sources of Alum.

Markets:
Markets.png

The main market centers of the region are Alexandria (yeah, it’s there! I’ve already reported its weird name-wrapping and one of our programmers is going to take a look at it) for the Mashreq, Damascus for the Syrian Levant and Mecca for the Hejaz.

Country and Location Population:
Country Population .png

Location Population 1.png

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Location Population 3.png
The population of the region points to Egypt being its powerhouse, with several million people being supported being the Nile Valley and Delta. Apart from that, the Syrian Levant has a very decent population, making the Mamlūk Sultanate a dreadful rival to have in 1337. The arid fringes make for a way more difficult food production and population sustainability, making them more of strategic value, by their position, resources, etc.

And that’s all for today! Next week @Johan will show you Scandinavia, the very first map that was crafted for Project Caesar! Cheers!
 
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Cultural. The culture colors might need to be made a bit more different, but they're there. I've also spoken about them:
Oh sorry, my wrong then. I honestly imagined for some areas as Akhmin a cultural differenciated majority, but is really an incredible and really nice improvement in that sense compared to EU4.

By the way, less known but not least important, will be Nubian populations in the southern area of Egypt? I ask it specially as Egypt in game map seems to reach further than the 1st cataract.
 
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(even if true, i havent bothered to check)

If you don't know anything and don't want to bother to find out, then why post? Why should I waste my time explaining to you the Saadi expedition when you can't be assed to do it yourself? Is basic research woke now?

I agree the AI on attrition is a concern but it needs to get it right in this game. It won't be better if there are no oases and if you can 'cheese' them then it is a broken system, not the oases' problem. I will let em make judgment on that, not bar arbitrary parts of the world bcuz the AI can't hack it.
 
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The idea is to have different available settings for this, yes.
Since I have not seen anyone else to mention it:
Are there any plans on making an option for wasteland coloring with the priority on oases or inner locations? Like, with this option on, if a country only has all the locations in Western Oases region and the Mamluks has all the surrounding coastal/Nile locations, the wasteland should show shall be painted with the color of oases nation. I think this could be applied to any secluded place on the world and would allow the player to have more pleasure in playing isolated nations, as they could feel like leading a huge Saharan/Siberian/Amazonian/whatsoever empire with only few core locations really controled.
Edit: spelling
 
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Miaphysite and Nestorian still seem like awkward choices when they have perfectly straightforward names for their rites - Oriental Orthodox and East Syriac Christianity.
 
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A bit of a different request, is it possible to get some more and brighter colours? I like the bright blues, pinks, teals and yellows EU4 has but the colour pallete is a lot more mute in this.
 
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Does it make sense to name the location Amman, when the city was abandoned for most of the span of the game? I feel like As-Salt would be more appropriate. It was the Ottoman capital of al-Balga and the most important city the region for a long time. Also, is Qala'at Ajloun present in the game as a fortress?
 
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If you don't know anything and don't want to bother to find out, then why post? Why should I waste my time explaining to you the Saadi expedition when you can't be assed to do it yourself? Is basic research woke now?

I agree the AI on attrition is a concern but it needs to get it right in this game. It won't be better if there are no oases and if you can 'cheese' them then it is a broken system, not the oases' problem. I will let em make judgment on that, not bar arbitrary parts of the world bcuz the AI can't hack it.
If you’re getting corrected by me you’re doing something wrong lol
 
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I've posted a thread Greek Dynamic Names Suggestions - Balkans and Cyprus which covers Crete and Cyprus from this Tinto Maps. Initially I was just doing the Balkans but seeing as I finished when this came out I figured I'd throw in Cyprus as well. In the future I may make a separate thread for Syria and Egypt as well.
 
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This is really about Iraq, but since you mentioned Nestorians…

Are Church of the East pops assigned Assyrian culture? (Similar to how Copts are handled)

Will we see any mechanism for the Church of the East schism - when Chaldeans split from Assyrians to join the Catholic Church? I believe this was around the same time as the Protestant Reformation so fits the age theme
 
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Considering the caliph was marginalized by the Mamluk sultan in 1338, it would be quite tough.
I didn't say it would be easy but it would be a fun game to manuever to get the caliph able to retake power, and then reclaim the caliphate and rebuild Baghdad back up again. Not easy by any means of course, but it sounds like a fun game to me. :)
 
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@Pavía

Okay, so.

A Twelver believes that the line of Imams ended with Muhammad al-Mahdi, who will only return during the apocalypse. A Nizari believes the line of Imams continues to this day in the line of the Fatimid Caliphs.

An Twelver most important source of religious leadership are the marja', hundreds of legal scholars who are experts in religious customs and law and work together to issue rulings. A Nizari's most important source of religious leadership is the Imam, the only Imam, the Imam of the Age who has authority as the manifestation of God's intellect.

An Twelver marja', though important, can only issue rulings on doctrine based on interpretations based on past rulings and consultation with other marja', and they have no way of enforcing their rulings. The Nizari Imam as the Living Imam and the manifestation of the divine word, has the authority to change and add doctrine as he sees fit to fit the times (the current Nizari Imam for example changed the amount of daily prayers from 5 to 3 and lifted the ban on usury that every other Islamic sect follows).

A Twelver's beliefs and practices can be both based on Sufi mysticism and legalistic Shari'a, though today with much more focus on the latter, focusing on an exoteric approach to religion centred on following "the rules". Nizari Isma'ilis have much more focus on the esoteric and the mystic, the inner meaning of religion (Batin), to the point that they call themselves the Batiniyya.

Twelvers have the view that the apocalypse is always just around the corner, that the Mahdi could come any day now. Nizaris interpret all the references to apocalypse, judgement and resurrection as fundamentally symbolic and esoteric, focusing more on the living in the current reality the way the Imam of the Age want them.

And of course, Twelvers and Nizaris don't see each other as just slightly different sects of the same tradition. There has been some effort in reconciliation today, but in the context of the medieval and early modern era, they would've seen each other as heretics!!

It really just makes no sense to have one Shi'i religion. There are differences with the Zaydis, the Tayyibis, etc. too of course, but I focus on the two biggest groups of Shi'ism I know of.
It's still not enough to consider each shiite sect different religion, otherwise we'll end up in hundreds protestant/reform sects as different religions, and possibly much more with various african and american religious practises.
If they're both considered shia, in general, I don't see why they should be presented as different religions instead of some sort of game mechanics, especially if some of them aren't very numerous, during the gameplay time.
 
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How are the Maronites represented? Just normal Catholics, or something else?

Really hoping for a proper representation of Eastern Catholicism!
Not getting the rush people have with wanting Eastern Catholics represented, for game-mechanic purposes it makes perfect sense for Catholicism to be relatively homogenous, as Eastern Catholics are still in full communion with Rome.

Not a fan. If we're grouping christians by christology instead of what the churches actually called themselves then orthodox and catholic should be one religion called "dyophysite"
There's not really a better term for them. "Oriental Orthodox" is a mouthful and potentially confusing, as is any variation of that.
"Miaphysite" is a common self-designation Oriental Orthodox use for themselves, so I don't see the issue.
The other option is splitting them between Armenian, Coptic, West Syriac, etc but I don't really see the point. I don't think these churches ever saw each other as heretical.
 
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What a fantastic job you guys have done here. The more I have advanced reading into the TM, the more I have seen such the nice work's been put into it. I love the resources, strategic food locations, cultures/pops... religions! Those corridors in the Sahara and Sinai Peninsula look as a great mechanic! I hope something similar (not depopulated locations though) can be done for mountain passes and such, as @SulphurAeron suggested in his thread for the Balkans and his post for Iberia.

BTW, someone said anything about the Balkans? Really, the incredible amount of variety of cultures and religions in this history-rich region gives me quite a bit of fear and joy at the same time haha. It's gonna be incredibly fun to play in it! Well, any place so far looks incredibly fun TBH :D
 
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May I suggest adding Rabyanah as an oasis location between Al Jawf and Tazirbu. It's an important Oasis with a population roughly a third of that of Al Jawf. But currently it's just wasteland, being slightly to the left of the passage between Al Jawf and Tazirbu.
IMG_3966.jpeg

Rabyanah shown in blue in the southwest

The location should be an Arid Flatlands Desert location which has roughly 1,000 Sunni Toubou pops. Which is half that of it's larger neighbours of Al Jawf and Tazirbu. The location should also produce livestock, similar to its neighbours. Finally, the passage between Al Jawf and Tazirbu should be changed to cut connect to Rabyanah instead, with it serving as an intermediary between them. The passage should also visibly change so that it actually connects to Rabyanah properly.

Overall I love this Tinto Maps so much, with Copts finally represented in a Paradox game and the level of granularity in the Nile, this Dev diary is almost perfect. Rabyanah would just make the Saharan representation perfect in my opinion, so I hope it gets added.

Edit: There shouldn't be a passage between Al Jawf and Siwa, the land between them is some of the harshest terrain in the Eastern Sahara. Caravans rarely ever went through it, instead usually getting to Al Jawf through Awjilah and Tazirbu. So I think that the Siwa-Al Jawf passage should be removed and replaced with an Awjilah-Tazirbu passage. Which means that to get from Egypt to Al Jawf you have to go through Awjilah, Tazirbu and Rabyanah. As that follows more established routes, also this doesn't cut the Mamluks off from any land they hold, as their last Saharan location is Siwa, with Al Jaef being owned by Fezzan.
 
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what is syrian levant? syria and levant are different names to the same region and used interchangeably.

also hit x for doubt on yezidi religion. did it really exist widespread in 1337?
 
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Why do you keep saying Syrian Levant rather than Syria or Sham or Levant? This is the first time I heard it
 
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