Tinto Talks #12 - 15th of May

[Hurpyderp]

There was a separate thread about this. They hadn't decided between slots or capacity yet. But they are currently leaning to capacity as it allows more granularity (as long as they don't end up with "3.697 capacity" required [lots of decimal places make it look bad] )

Thanks for the heads up!

 

[antrachton]

hre map mode i assume. with electors? with kingdoms? with free cities?

and moldavia does exist apparently

So where did you find these maps?

 

[Thorum]

So where did you find these maps?

Scroll way up

 

[Fratedp]

Pls paradox, tell me that brescia is a releadable nation. I promise we are an important city, from the victory against frederich ii, to the extensive manufactories present in the city during the serenissima age. The city was actually indipendent from 1404 to 1421 where Pandolfo III Malatesta took brescia as a reward from Giangaleazzo Visconti, and proceded to decleared indipendence .

I am part of a historical reenactment group from brescia an it would be really a bummer to see such a beatifull and history reach city go to waste.

 

[guten_tag]

Are there still gonna be the colony's in Greenland since they were abandoned in the 15th century?

 

[Teng_Ri]

So where did you find these maps?

from johan himself. he sends me a couple every wednesday

 

[tonyzhu163]

There's research thatd disagrees with the view that the Chinese tribute system was designed to benefit China at the expense of its tributees. Instead, Chinese tributaries and China benefitted from the relationship. One of those aspects involved China sending money to fund its tributaires' missions to China, which I believe is what is portrayed in that relationship, with Yuan sending money to its tributaries. I don't remember exactly the dynamics, but as far as I know it is accurate for the tributaires to benefit from China's overlordship

I'm not an expert, but I remember Chinese historical records showing that the returning gift from the emperor back to the envoys were typically more valuable then the gifts that they provided to the Chinese court: e.g. receiving some wild beasts and giving back silk or gold.

 

[HighQualityPink]

@Johan Please I am begging you, is it possible to have the name of an overlord take over the name space of their subject on the map just like in CK2?

 

[tonyzhu163]

My CD Team has been doing some additional research for the Chinese subjects, and they think Zhū Hóu naming instead of Fēng Chén is a reasonable suggestion, so they're changing that today .

Let me add to this as a native speaker in both languages. 封臣 is about a 1-1 map for vassal, but its not typically used in a Chinese context. Normally its used to described Feudal Europe in Chinese.

诸侯 is also weird, because 诸侯 (literally meaning "the nobles/ dukes/ feudal princes") is an historical term referring to a specific group within the Chinese state with varying degrees of power across history. This term first described the various warring states during the Zhou Dynasty, which was a purely feudal arrangement, the Zhu of Zhuhou means many/ numerous, and Hou is a specific noble title which maps to Marquis.

After the Zhou, China has had periods where it both had prefectures ruled by a central bureaucracy as well as feudal states at the same time, such as the Han Dynasty and Jin Dynasty, who both famously had their Zhuhou rebel. Zhuhou just refers to the nobles who ruled over the feudal portion of the empire. This term would get less and less use over history as China became more centralized, but it would not apply to a tributary system, since they would not be considered part of the Chinese state, so there isn't any feudal vassalage anyways.

In the EU timeframe, the Fanwang who were relatives of the Ming emperor titled as Kings could technically be Zhuhou, but they did not have enough power to be modeled as an independent state and were solely military governors, they were largely deprived of this right later into the dynasty as well. So this term is largely not used in Chinese history past probably 1000CE.


藩属国 (Fanshu) or 朝贡国 (Chaogong) is almost always the direct term used to describe a tributary.

 

[hibojor]

Bit late but wow this looks amazing!

Couple questions about IO's tho;
1. Will the game have content up to the Napoleonic/late early-modern period? And if yes,
2. Will there be a mechanic for disbanding IOs into individual countries, like how a certain average height for the time Frenchman did to the HRE?

Keep up the great work

 

[J1r2000]

Is it bad that I hope "pure" Conquest CBs will be disabled for the first portion of the game amongst non-heretical Christians? Subjugation should be a thing, but just taking land in offensive wars feels like it should be more difficult politically and game-wise early game.

 

[wkscrombie]

yeah, we have been trying to figure out a better name for this for the last 2.5 years we've had the system.

“Institutions”, perhaps?

 

[Spartakus]

Are there still gonna be the colony's in Greenland since they were abandoned in the 15th century?

The existence of the colony in Greenland was mentioned as one of the reasons for a 1337 start date. So it's almost certainly in.

 

[Raazossaku]

A cool idea would be for the current country that is the chinese emperor to change its country to Great (dynasty name), example great yuan, great ming, great qing.

More accurately, it should be any country that claims to be Emperor, as even the relatively tiny and short-lived Xi dynasty called itself Great Xi. Countries whose title of Emperor of China is undisputed should be called Unified Great X instead, in the model of 大明一統 (Unified Great Ming) and 大清一統 (Unified Great Qing)

 

[DeBouwvakker]

Could be yes, but its unique per IO if the content designer has designed it that way.

"if the content designer has designed it that way".

It seems like content designers get a lot of freedom in the way they design things, does this mean the designers at Tinto get a lot of freedom in the way the choose designs, and what are the different backgrounds for these designers?

 

[Vojvoda Drago]

Looking forward to seeing the Slavic population (Sorbs/Polabians) in Eastern Germany next time x)

 

[Johan]

It seems like content designers get a lot of freedom in the way they design things, does this mean the designers at Tinto get a lot of freedom in the way the choose designs, and what are the different backgrounds for these designers?

They are modders & historians.

 

[Pavel Holec]

Hi,

I would like to ask why Upper Lusatia is connected to Bohemia, while Lower Lusatia remains a separate entity called Lusatia. I understand that this might have been done to reduce the number of subjects on the map, but it feels somewhat disappointing to me. Bohemia has remained largely consistent in its boundaries since its early history (with some exceptions like the Cheb region and a few smaller areas along the Polish border). The northern "tentacle" is not part of Bohemia, and I believe it should be a separate entity, similar to Moravia or parts of Silesia.

Thank you for your response, and I wish you the best of luck in completing the top secred Project Cesar.

 

[Finardin]

Will the continental system be an international organization that can be formed?

 

[EddieDean]

I really like a previous poster's suggestion to call these 'International Associations'. An association is "a group connected or cooperating for a joint purpose or common interests", which absolutely applies here. An organisation implies more of a specific structure with well defined roles and functions. Many of your examples here are organisations, but not all of them - whereas all of them are associations.

Speaking of language, I know the term "buildings" have been used in many Paradox games before, but are these not better defined as "industries"? A building is, well, a single building, but on a location-by-location basis are we not tweaking the inputs and outputs of the whole industry in that location? For example, this area produces wood, so we'll intervene in its logging industry. And this location has iron, so let's improve that area's iron mining industry, and perhaps build and grow a steel milling industry in that area too. Those industries might have some size value as we grow them, perhaps lightly representing buildings (though more likely simply the processing size), but they're whole regional industries rather than buildings, are they not?

And that way we can also consider the inputs/outputs of our industries at many levels - the countrywide logging industry (and its laws/PMs) versus local regional logging industries (which might have specialised/different PMs). These are both industries of two scales, rather than saying 'all the logging buildings in the country' or 'all the logging buildings in the region'.

Similarly, other 'buildings' which have previously been called things like 'developments' (for example Government Administration, Universities, or railways in Victoria 3) might be better defined as "infrastructure", being not specifically buildings or industries, but part of the state infrastructure.